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Thread: EPF 2016 dividend

  1. #31
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    That is a curry paste where I copied and paste the links which is the expressions of the "experts" as they are from the The Star and other credible publication. there is another publication from Malaysia Chronicle on EPF but the link could not be curry paste with headlines EPF BOOKS SHOCK RM8.17BIL LOSS DUE TO PLUNGING ... http://www.malaysia-chronicle.com/ep...-share-market/ Why is it a problem to your goodness?

    It is up to the readers to decide and for me to know if the expresso is foamy. If it is not good , kindly clarify. As far as I know I am not cooking stories.....just raising the issue which is beyond my comprehension After all, I am one of the stakeholder of Pomzi mutual fund. The free expression is within the rights to express what is going on board.

    The forum is for those less learned and for those who are good enough to korek it. I dun have a problem to learn what is wrong and right with EPF is doing.
    Last edited by zinglicious; 20-02-2017 at 08:01 PM.
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  2. #32
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    These info are from kwsp website.
    This is such a negative surprise for me. Gross income was 46.5 bio but dividend payable only 37 bio.
    Investment assets stood at 731 bio, while members' claim is 704 bio. Keeping a buffer of 27 bio. Isnt this robbing peter (contributors now) to pay paul (future contributors)?

    5.7% is a huge disappointment. Now wondering if should withdraw it out and investment directly.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinglicious View Post
    That is a curry paste where I copied and paste the links which is the expressions of the "experts" as they are from the The Star and other credible publication. there is another publication from Malaysia Chronicle on EPF but the link could not be curry paste with headlines EPF BOOKS SHOCK RM8.17BIL LOSS DUE TO PLUNGING ... http://www.malaysia-chronicle.com/ep...-share-market/ Why is it a problem to your goodness?

    It is up to the readers to decide and for me to know if the expresso is foamy. If it is not good....
    For the sake of my reading pressure, I sincerely hope you do not post and/or reply in thread started by me. I believe you have an incredibly unique way in expressing your thoughts that ordinary average folks like me find it difficult and challenging to comprehend.

    I'm sorry that I'm not in the same class with you. Hence I can't understand your posts and I seriously think I should not waste your time.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by opulant View Post
    My expectation is 6.1%. I think the net impairment of 8.17 billion is the main reason of lower dividend. Of course, in anticipating of a worse 2017, keeping some of the 2016 income as not to look terribly bad in 2017 dividend payout can be the reason too.

    " As at 31 December 2016, a total of 48.58% of the EPF investment asset was invested in fixed income instruments and 42.33% in Equities, while the remaining 4.03% and 5.06% were in Real Estate & Infrastructure and Money Market Instruments respectively. Therefore, it is natural that the EPF�s investment performance to be skewed towards fixed income returns. In accordance with the Malaysian Financial Reporting Standards (MFRS 139), the EPF is required to recognise net impairment amounting to RM8.17 billion, compared with RM3.07 billion in 2015 to reflect the lower equity prices, particularly in the domestic banking sector and oil & gas sectors in both the domestic and foreign markets. "


    http://www.kwsp.gov.my/portal/en/new...etailPage=true

    When I read the KWSP press statement on Sunday, my immediate concern is the so-called "net impairment" of RM8.17 billion mainly contributed by the under-performing local equities notably in the banking and O&G sectors. I think this year will be equally bad or even worse for local equities. As reported, close to half of EPF investment is in equities and big churn of them are in local market. Hence, next year dividend payout will not be good and this prompt me to think they are keeping some of this year money for next year.

    Although withdrawing the savings in EPF and invest in other instruments seem to be a better option at this moment as the dividend is not as attractive as before but the problem is --> it is difficult or almost not possible to find another fixed-income instrument that can yield return as good as EPF in 3-5 years period. Bonds have a long locked-in period and the yield is flat, not compounded.

    From the past 30 years, I was told all sort of negative comments of EPF when I was 20s, 30s, 40s and even now, such comments are still around. Yes, they are politicians who tried and still strying to treat EPF as their personal ATM but the political influence can't shake the EPF in big magnitude if one really look at the fund size as witnessed from the time of apanama in the 80s until now.

    I always advise my younger relatives and colleages to keep their money in EPF whenever is possible. I firmly believe if one is not too ambitious, money in EPF should remain there to reap the benefits of long term compounding. Money in FD should find a new home now either in bonds or other instruments as the FD rate is getting too low.


    and last but not least, I noticed (just my personal opinion) those who enjoy making tons of criticism on EPF normally are those who belong to a group of people that no matter how high the EPF dividend rate, it doesn't have any meaningful impact on them...

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by opulant View Post
    When I read the KWSP press statement on Sunday, my immediate concern is the so-called "net impairment" of RM8.17 billion mainly contributed by the under-performing local equities notably in the banking and O&G sectors. I think this year will be equally bad or even worse for local equities. As reported, close to half of EPF investment is in equities and big churn of them are in local market. Hence, next year dividend payout will not be good and this prompt me to think they are keeping some of this year money for next year.

    Although withdrawing the savings in EPF and invest in other instruments seem to be a better option at this moment as the dividend is not as attractive as before but the problem is --> it is difficult or almost not possible to find another fixed-income instrument that can yield return as good as EPF in 3-5 years period. Bonds have a long locked-in period and the yield is flat, not compounded.

    From the past 30 years, I was told all sort of negative comments of EPF when I was 20s, 30s, 40s and even now, such comments are still around. Yes, they are politicians who tried and still strying to treat EPF as their personal ATM but the political influence can't shake the EPF in big magnitude if one really look at the fund size as witnessed from the time of apanama in the 80s until now.

    I always advise my younger relatives and colleages to keep their money in EPF whenever is possible. I firmly believe if one is not too ambitious, money in EPF should remain there to reap the benefits of long term compounding. Money in FD should find a new home now either in bonds or other instruments as the FD rate is getting too low.


    and last but not least, I noticed (just my personal opinion) those who enjoy making tons of criticism on EPF normally are those who belong to a group of people that no matter how high the EPF dividend rate, it doesn't have any meaningful impact on them...
    I share almost the same sentiments.
    epf is about the largest institutional buyer in Bursa. They blitz in, buy/sell/buy and make a few big buck spread. When 1 have such volume to play with, i can't smirk at even a paltry 2-3% daily gain.

    Admitedly, 'short term' 3-5 yrs Bond will command a premium. But in situ the 6.1% coupon is looking to be an eye candy indeed.
    The recent retail one i posted, bond over 7 yrs is now almost fully subscribed(based on rumors) . The option of taking some hard earned moolah outta epf and redirect to this 6.1% coupon is fast running out as an option.

    Your calc /comparison is based on a 5.5% compoundable versus a fixed 6.15 non compoundable. And with the current scenario , i have my doubts on epf giving out 5.5% for the next 2-3yrs. They might be able to do this if upon gomen (of course, they will deny it) instruction, they cash out, bring home all those o/seas properties they have bought last 2 yrs. The prop gain of which might just be thru sheer slide of the Shringgit.
    So, if say even at 5% compoundable, the net will still be less than the noncompoundable 6 in total. Unless my calc is off tangent lah.
    So iF i have the moolah I will go for the latter option. With possible opportunity cost arising outta the paid coupon. no?

    I also agree that those who criticised or continue criticising epf are those with either too much or too little in there The inbetween, just twiddle their thumbs... No confidence in epf?? Well, Fat chance those Little Red Dotters or LOS invaders or even the Kominis Cina gonna be overruning & sapu all the epf...so Yes, currently it is still a gomen endorsed ponzi, esp benefitting for those enjoying life at 50 onwards...
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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by tupai View Post
    I.... So, if say even at 5% compoundable, the net will still be less than the noncompoundable 6 in total.

    Unless my calc is off tangent lah...
    Yes, your calculation is correct.

    Refer back to the hypothetical number of 2.1m as initial sum ... and 30% goes to a 6% coupon.

    The total gain after 7 years is 863,038. If all the 2.1m stay in EPF, the gain is 854,911.

    Over a 7 years period, the loss of 8k is pretty marginal.

    I am willing to take the risk that the EPF dividend is at least 5.5%... and even is between 5.0-5.5%, the compounding will be able to cushion the loss.

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