KESAS-EXPRESS TAG .. we are ripped off!

[sundaygirl]

Hi all

I am not sure how many of you are owners of Express Tag, but checked this out ...excerpts from
KESAS.com.my (http://www.kesas.com.my)
"PLEASE BE INFORMED THAT THE Express TAG SERVICES WILL BE DISCONTINUED WITH EFFECT FROM 30 JUNE 2004 (12.00 Midnight) BASED ON GOVERNMENT’S INSTRUCTIONS.KESAS WILL ONLY REFUND UNUSED PREPAID BALANCE TO ALL THE Express TAG USERS AND THERE SHALL NOT BE ANY OTHER REFUNDS EXAMPLE THE COST OF TAGS.ANY INCONVENIENCE CAUSED IS MUCH REGRETTED."

They refused to reimbursed our tag deposits! I can't remember how much I paid ($100??) but I believe this is a ripped off. If KESAS discontinued the tag service, the the tag is a waste ... but for us drivers, we deserve to be refunded when we return the tag to KESAS. KESAS has no concrete reason not to refund us .... opinions please!

What else can we do to stop this ...

[Dr. J George]

Please be assured that The Consumers Association of Subang and Shah Alam, Selangor (CASSA) is looking into this matter after receiving several feedbacks from irritated consumers.

We are presently initiating discussions with the office of the Minister of Works, Malaysia - Dato' Dr. S' Samy Velu and hope our efforts will be rewarded with a fair and equitable refund to all concerned.

Your undivided support to CASSA on this matter is welcome.

Thank you. ;)

[KH EE]

Post #300! Yahoo! Budiman ke3! 'nuff said!

Read somewhere that any non-Touch&GO's smartags should be exchanged to a smartag, one for one, at NO extra charge as the current tag-users are forced, by law, to relinquished their tags!

[Firefly]

Is this confirmed? If so, which office or place to do this exchange?

[cskok8]

Many thanks to T&G and its Swindler COO.

[KH EE]

I believe that for those whose tags r uploaded via credit cards will be refunded via their credit cards but for cash may hv to go to their ofiices located at most toll booth.

here's hoping cassa & the rest will fight for more. And as usual it'll go to cabinet/badawi for a decision! :rolleyes:

[sundaygirl]

i wouldnt count on the refund, wouldn't count on smart tag replacement either ... but i guess tht is the best option that we could hope for

thanks CASSA for highlighting this issue
:rolleyes:

[KH EE]

don't bet on it, sundaygirl as, as usual, SuperBadawi will come to the rescue... :o

[orchipalar]

Hi:) - Orchi is one of them buggers, who doesn't believe in depositing money for something which Orchi needs to expense later with the authority. Only need to pay as n when required to. So Orchi could queue up like everybody else in the respective lanes before the toll plazas. N when its Orchi's turn to pay, Orchi would get the fun to greet, offer the change, give a smile n bid farewell to the collectors.:)

Over the years, Orchi has grown accustomed to doing that since they first had tolls at Sg. Besi n Labu, way back from 77 day in n day out man..:)

Pay now use later, never worked out for Orchi, n this being one of the feared reasons.:(

[cpleong]

I've just went to Fasttrack office along the Sunway toll.
I redeemed by Kesas tag (RM50)and my balance.

I was one of the first few tag purchases, and took advantage of the 50% discount on the tag price. Subsequent buyers have to pay RM100.

CP.

[achee]

Thanks CP for the info. Achee still have some 3bucks in there, and didn't bother to go thru the hassle at first.

Question........achee's is Fastrak. Do you think achee will be refuded too, just like your kesas tag?

Getting back 50bucks is worth an effort.:)

[sundaygirl]

Do you mean they agreed to refund Fastrack but not Express Tag?
... Fastrack & Exp Tag are two different items, right? Mine has the word Express Tag written over it.

[KH EE]

satish, what's ur advice? redeem now or after 30/6? :)

[cpleong]

The advise from the counter girl is to redeem now.
If you procrastinate like every other Malaysian does, you will face a long line of processing towards the last two weeks of deadline.

Achee, you should redeem. It is not just your 3 dollars. you will also redeem the price of your tag.

S'girl, my tag was also Express Tag. No worries. They will refund you.

And btw, the refund comes in two options :

1. Fill in the form for refund, and one of the columns provided request you to fill in bank acct # and branch. They will credit directly into your account.

2. The other option, is to wait for the cheque to be issued to you, via snail mail.

And both methods will take around 1 month to process.

p.s. I took option 1.
CP.

[cpleong]

And, also, next to the Fast Track office, there is a group of durian sellers.

For all durian lovers,

They sell kampung durians at RM10 for three. The current batch they have are better than the "Loong Har", 101, D24.

Yellow flesh, a bit bitter sweetish...d best.
CP.

p/s: watch out for cacing holes though. The guys opens the durian windows very fast. Check first before you ask him to open. And he tends to pick the small ones for you. I learnt it the hard way, but you guys don't have to make the same mistake.

[KH EE]

TQ cpleong. that means i can get my refund at the sunway toll office even tho mine's an expresstag?

[cpleong]

It warrants a call to their office before you go there.
Mine was an Fasttrack Express Tag.

Do note that everytime you go to their office, you will inevitably end up paying for toll because you have to pass their toll to U-turn either way.

CP.

[KH EE]

cp tq again.

[sundaygirl]

i haven't act on anything yet but bear in mind that ...
KESAS runs ELITE .. therefore Express Tag
LITRAK runs LDP .. therefore Fastrack

do I make sense?

[cpleong]

You are right.

My first visit was to the Kesas counter along the USJ-Bkt Jalil Kesas highway. I was bounced out because my tag shows Fasttrack.

I was refered to the Sunway Litrak Fastrack office, where I got my refund.

Pardon me if I have given wrong info earlier. Please check your tags. S'girl is right.

CP.

[cskok8]

Although the two tags are usable at both highways you could not even top-up at the other operators office. So it stands to reason (by Malaysian standard) that you have to go to the operator you bought the tag from for the refund.

[shali]

The unutilised cash value of the the card is refundable, even if there had been no offer, as a result of 'government's instruction'. That 'government's instruction' is useless in court, as far as the issue of refund is concerned. They have to bear the economic loss, not the users.

With regard to the tag cost or the main unit cost, I suppose it may be argued that those units were 'sold' and that legal title passes completely to the buyer and therefore no refund is obligated.

But the units may (Im unsure though) be rendered unuseable as a result of the chaos of change. Check out any printed conditions on the receipt/brochure (if any) issued by the toll operators when you first acquired it. If CASSA could help, all the better for us.

[KH EE]

shali, u're right but there's no harm trying... :)

now will hv to dig up the kesas contract entered into dogs years ago 2 read the fine print... :cool:

& here's the bad news (maybe?)... last nite i emailed kesas that if litrak can refund their tags, why can't they do the same? If kesas talk 2 litrak, then maybe litrak won't refund... better go over 2 litrak to get ur tag's refund.

[KH EE]

Smart Tags to be cheaper By LEONG SHEN-LI

PETALING JAYA: The price of Smart Tags is expected to go down by 20% ahead of the standardisation of the electronic toll collection (ETC) system on July 1.

Sources said the tag, currently sold at RM220, would cost about RM180 following a government request to the system’s operator, Rangkaian Segar Sdn Bhd, to lower its price.

However, they could not say when the new price would become effective.

“The Malaysian Highway Authority will make an announcement on the matter soon before the single ETC system is implemented on July 1,” they said.

When contacted, Rangkaian Segar chief operating officer Swinder Grewal declined to comment.

Last year, the Government gave expressway concessionaires until June 30 to phase out their own ETC systems following a Cabinet decision that the Touch ‘n Go system, which used Touch ‘n Go cards and Smart Tags, would be the sole ETC system in the country.

The other ETC systems currently in use are the Fastrak, used on the Damansara-Puchong Expressway and Sprint Expressway, the ExpressTag on the Shah Alam Expressway, and the Saga Tag on the Cheras-Kajang Expressway.

Besides removing their ETC systems, the concessionaires are also supposed to provide at least two Touch ‘n Go and one Smart Tag lane in each direction at all toll plazas.

Shah Alam Expressway concessionaire, Kesas Sdn Bhd, has placed a notice on its website www.kesas.com.my announcing that the use of the ExpressTag would end at midnight on June 30.

“Automatic reloading of tags will be terminated with effect from June 25. Reloading can still be carried out at toll plazas,” the notice said.

It also stated that users would be able to receive refunds on the unused balance in the tag. However, the company would not refund the cost of the tag, it added.

---------------------------------------------
When I bought it when it 1st started, the tags were at rm98 each & it's now at rm220 to be reduced to rm180! It's definitely not cheap &, with the monopoly taking place, GOD knows what they'll think up next. :confused:

[pcyeoh]

I suspect why they priced it so high could be due to two reasons.

1. They want to make it very exclusive to those who can afford it. Or else if Ah Toos, Ahmads and Muthus can afford it, the service will be not much of a difference compared to the T n G. Tan Sri Kadir Jasin in his article in the Times complained very loudly when PLUS allowed the T n G cards users to use the SmartTag lane during the festival rush period. The Tan Sri was saying "We pay RM 220 for this exclusive use throughout the year." He was right. I couldn't agree more than that. From that day onwards I feel it is worth every single cent of the RM 220. Reducing it to RM 180 is a proof of my theory - still no big deal but at least Semi Value can say that he has got them to reduce the price.

2. The computerised system for the SmartTag cannot cope up with too large a volume. I last heard there are close to 250,000 SmartTag users. Currently, the response time of the barrier is very good. I have tried going thru at 50 kmph and the barrier was up in no time. My friend tried to break my record at 60 kmph and went thru the barrier without his windscreen breaking. It was just unbelievable. He was driving a BMW. Unless you are driving one, pls don't try that.

[KH EE]

Smartag is definitely not the better system. Am trying to find the P. Gunesegaran's article which came out in theSun last year - very informative.

[achee]

Thank you guys.

Achee went to the office at puchong toll plaza. Fill up the form and should be receiving RM53.40 in one month.

Next KYB, achee ta-pau snacks. Do you think stadium curryhse allow outside food????? (Even without the refund, achee will still ta-pau something from home)

[achee]

Achee bought 2nd smart tag for rm150. There was a promotion a couple of years ago.

Sidekick....... achee's 1st smarttag got stolen when someone smashed the side window while car parked within hse compound. So, don't "show off" you smart tag!

BTW, can the device be produced by other manufacturers? Achee just wonder. Is it that complicated? The device uses infra red frequency just like other devices. Maybe those with electronic background can enlighten achee on this.


p/s p/s
Where's CHL.........so quiet one. Y?

[cskok8]

Is there a patent on this thingy? If not (or even if there is) I wonder why nobody has pirated it yet. After all we have some of the best pirates in the world. If they can make and sell it for about RM 50 each I will be lining up for one.

[pcyeoh]

I will be lining up behind you, cskok8

[clfoo]

T & G SmarTags definitely not a better system, don't need to compare far, take Fast Track as comparison and we just concentrate on the approach of customer service aspect from both company:

1) Their system still cannot accept auto reloading with any credit card of customer's choice.
2) Reload at ATM need to pay surcharge.
3) No rebate for auto reloading as given by Fast Track.
4) Unit cost of Smart Tags much more expensive than Fast Track and no warranty on defect unit.


Would like to post this question for Rangkaian Segar's Monopoly Awareness Test:

They are given the right to monopoly why they have yet to intergrate with all public transport ticketing system?
or
do they found no more motivation to improve after given right to monopoly?

[cskok8]

pcyeoh, I welcome you to the queue but not too close behind me please.

[KH EE]

Recd this email from kesas regarding my enquiry as to why their tags r not refundable while litrak is refunding theirs:-

-------------------------------------
From: "Khairani Mohamed Salleh" <khai@kesas.po.my>
To: giko2159@yahoo.com
Subject: Refund of E5 Tags
Date: Mon, 7 Jun 2004 17:39:51 +0800

Dear goki2159,

Thank you for your inquiry through e-mail dated 3 June 2004. KESAS is still looking for the best way to resolve the issue of refunding the cost of the tags to our users. However each tag sold is in accordance to the company's terms and conditions and there's a warranty of two years for it. We will inform our "Express TAG" users on the decision of the tag refund as soon as possible.

Thank you & Regards
Public Relations Department
-------------------------------------

Q1 - is this a standard letter?
Q2 - maybe got chance?
Q3 - go figure... :p

[Dr. J George]

The PR section or any toll company can say anything they want.

As far as The Consumers Association of Subang and Shah Alam, Selangor (CASSA) is concerned we stick by our advice to these toll companies's senior Management to refund the rightful dues in a manner befitting the relationship.

We have told them that we stand by our friend consumers who are inncocent parties caught in between the inexplicable changes pertaining to toll collection and 'suka suka policy switches'.

Failure of which will incur our wrath and that of our friends in PUTRAJAYA and specially, of ONE at the Ministry of Works Malaysia with whom, we have a 'love love relationship'!

If the leadership of these companies are reading this - I hope you have got my drift and check my claim out before the hurricane strikes you!

Cheers!:p :D

[KH EE]

that's the way we like it... ah-ha, ah-ha... :D

I was advised by lord during the TT session last sat nite to PM DJG if I want to get a full refund of my kesas express tag. So forumers do PM DJG/cassa to strengthen our case. TQ

[chookyan]

Dear All,

Went to Wisma Kesas at Sunway Toll this morning to get the refund for Express Tag, was told to fill up the form and come back in 3 weeks time to collect the refund cheque. Just can't believe it, we paid in advance and yet have to wait for the refund. Wonder what our Dato' Samy Vellu has to say ???

[KH EE]

Samy would say something like this:-

"Dulu kita sudah cakap pada dia orang jangan bikin ini ahhh..."
Some one whispered out aloud: "Fastrack!"

"ya, fastrack atau kesas tag. Kita bilang guna satu sistem saja ahhh..." Assistant: "touch n go"

"ya, touch & go sistem. Dia orang tak mau dengar dan tengok apa sudah jadi. Sekarang dia orang tak mau refund ini fastrack, saya tak tahu-lah. But we'll bring this up at the next cabinet meeting..."

[isarahim]

Originally posted by KH EE
But we'll bring this up at the next cabinet meeting..."

I think he meant "after the next election".

[patrick]

chookyan are they refunding you the balance of the value or plus the deposit/purchase of the tag?

And KHEE, can you please provide the email address of the KESAS guy so that we can also write to him to express our displeasure? Thanks.

Rgds.

[chookyan]

Patrick - Kesas will only refund the balance of the value left but not the deposit or price of the tag. We are made as the suckers again.

APA BOLEH BUAT?

[KH EE]

Patrick, as requested:-

Name: Khairani Mohamed Salleh
email : khai@kesas.po.my>

[xweird]

http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2004/6/29/nation/8319795&sec=nation

Touch ’n Go system on all highways from Thursday

KUALA LUMPUR: The Touch 'n Go toll collection system will be implemented on all highways from Thursday, Works Minister Datuk Seri S. Samy Vellu said yesterday.

“There won't be any more extensions. The highway concessionaires have been given a year's grace period to install the necessary devices to implement the system,” he said.

Speaking to reporters after launching an anti-smoking and anti-illegal samsu campaign for youths at SJK (T) Vivekananda, Samy Vellu said the Cabinet’s decision was conveyed to the chief executive officers of the concessionaires last week.

“I was told that one or two concessionaires had not bought the equipment to install the Touch 'n Go system. If they can’t install them, they have to collect the toll charges manually,” he said.

He said Rangkaian Segar Sdn Bhd, which issues and markets the Smart Tag, has been directed to reduce the price of the smart card holder to RM150 from RM180.

In his speech, Samy Vellu said that about 50 to 60 youths were taking up smoking daily, with students making up 8% of the 4.6 million smokers in the country.

He said there was also an increase in the number of youths consuming liquor.

[sundaygirl]

Hi all

On 8pm TV news last night (unsure whether it was RTM1 or TV3 or NTV7), KESAS CEO (or was it MD?) was interviewed by a reporter and I heard the statement "YES, WE WILL REFUND (the Express Tag)." Did he mean that KESAS now will refund the balance plus the DEPOSIT paid by users?

Did anyone watch that last night?

[KH EE]

that's interesting sundaygirl. I will email khairani 4 more - hope it's in our favour! smartag @ rm150 is still triple of that of fastrack - try rm50, samy!

[sundaygirl]

see below, a reply KESAS PR Dept to me

----- Original Message -----
From: Khairani Mohamed Salleh
To: __
Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2004 12:12 PM
Subject: RE: EXPRESS TAG refund


Dear __,

YES, it is true that KESAS CEO has made a press statement saying that KESAS will make all the refunds - prepaid balance and Express Tag cost. I believe , if you read any newspapers, you'll find about it in the newspaper also.

Unlike TnG, the card purchased was considered deposit but Express Tag was solely sold to the owner, which by legal is not supposed to be refunded. But we are refunding it now anyway.

We are not ' switching policy ikut suka hati', but if you are an employee, then you should have know that any reliable company have a group of Board Directors, who only make the decisions to refund the unused balance and tag cost just last week.

We wish to thank you if you are one of our loyal Express Tag user and drive safely.

[KH EE]

TQ sunday. :)

I'll be stopping by on 1/7/04 to get my refunds (that's unused balance plus cost of express tag!). will report back if it's true... :o

Now onto the task of lowering the smartags! :confused: :mad: :rolleyes: :eek:

[KH EE]

Read from today's Malay Mail on page 11:-

Express Tag refund from Thursday

Express Tag users can get refunds of their Express Tag unit and the prepaid balance from Thursday until Dec 31. After 31/12, refunds can still be made at Wisma Kesas at Leburaya Shah Alam in SJ.
... Users hv 2 bring the tags together with their IC's...
...any1 can collect the refund on behalf of the user by bringing an authorisation letter with the owner's signature and a copy of the IC.
...registered owner can collect the refund in cash, cheque or through their bank a/c.
... Users can return the Tags at the following toll plazas:-
1. Sunway
2. Kemuning
3. Awan Besar East
4. Awan Besar West

Time:- 7am-9pm, Mon's thru Fri's
7am-1pm, 2nd & 4th Sat's
7am-5pm, Sun's but refund by cheque only

[sundaygirl]

thanks all who contributed to this topic :]
now to get the SMART TAG .. or should wait until price go down ?(my fingers r crossed)

** sundaygirl **

[KH EE]

u shld wait sundaygirl as loh seng kok has started the ball rolling thanks 2 ppl like me (ahem!, TQ TQ :D )

anyway samy wants smartag 2 be priced at rm150 from the current rm180 but we want it lower - rm50! Now to start a new thread re: smartag at rm50...:o

don't buy smartag yet, sundaygirl.

[patrick]

Has anyone got back their full refund (includes cost of tag) from Kesas yet?

Buy express tag? Having second thoughts now after the 'shattering' experience with the express tag. Unless they bring it down to less than Rm50.

[chookyan]

Dear All,

Went to Wisma Kesas at the Sunway toll yesterday at 0730 and again this morning at 0800 respectively. Still can't get the refund as both time was told by staff manning the control centre that the staff in charge of the refund is still not in inspite of the notice which states open at 0800. On the way out met some other highway users who says that they still cannot get their refund inspite going there a couple of times as the person in charge in always not there.

[patrick]

My gosh...how low can they stoop? Trying to delay refund what?

[KH EE]

Why don't u email to Khairani Mohamed Salleh at khai@kesas.po.my to inform him of the delay. Also email Loh Seng Kok at lohsengkok@kelanajaya.com or Lee Hwa Beng at : hwabeng@pc.jaring.my

Or better still write to the press! :o

[titz]

For info of expresstag users.

I got my refund of RM100 plus balance of unused amount for my tag on 6 July at 10.56:13 am at the Sunway plaza office.

Thanks.

Happy surfing.

[KH EE]

titz, I'm a bit confused. When you said "at the Sunway plaza office", do you mean the office located just after the first Kesas toll coming from Subang & just b4 the turning to Sunway OR the fastrack office at Sunway toll? :D

[titz]

Sorry KH for the confusion, it's at the Kesas Sdn Bhd Office, beside the kesas highway toll plaza, the first one after the right turn from Summit USJ.

But I don't think you can you get your refund for your expresstag issued by kesas at the LDP office and vice versa for your fastrak.

Thanks.


Happy surfing.

[patrick]

That's good news titz! I better go there fast before they run out of cash!

Rgds.

[cskok8]

For manual reload tags, they refund the balance plus cost of tag (RM 100 or 50 - depending on the purchase price) in cash. For auto-reload ones, have to wait for them to send a cheque.

[uchangeng]

Now that the "SMART TAG" sign board is up and we have also lost our Express Tag deposit, there is NOT enough smart tag to go around. The last time I went to the PLUS office(Shah Alam) to get one was yesterday and I was told to come back again in September, may be they will have one for me!

1st., they rip you off the old tag deposits(RM50), 2nd, you have to wait weeks on end to BUY the new tag. 3rd., you have to queue up at every toll to pay your way thru. until you get the new tag.

This clearly shows the weakness and poor attitude in the way our Government Link Company do their job! How can they ever survive in a free market without handout?

What is going on here, Pak Lah?

[CH]

I think this is typical Malaysian attitude at work.

Wait till last minute hope that the govenment will postpone the ruling, and than rush to get the new tag.

Plus pula, never thinks people will rush to get the tag and never keep enough stock to answer the request ...

sigh:

[KH EE]

Just got my refund for kesas tag & unused balance, in cash, altho' earlier notices said that, for auto reload, it's to be pd by chq... :)

anyway just a note to others that refunds on/after 1 sept will be made in chqs... so for those who hv yet to get their refund, better do it now. :D

saw a new signboard above the toll plaza... "EXPRESS CARD DAN TUNAI"... any1 knows what's this? another new type of t&go card or what?

[fatalshak]

Hi All,

I went to KESAS Toll Plaza at Kemuning (KL Bound) on a weekday .. voila sekejap only got my RM100 back in cash ... but went straight to PLUS tag .. :mad:

[cskok8]

Where did you get the DUMB Tag from? I thought they were out of stock.

[fatalshak]

He he he

[uchangeng]

If you want your refund in CASH., pls. do it before Sept 16th., 2004 at any KESAS office. After this date, KESAS will pay the refund in check.

I got my full refund, deposite and the balance amount, yesterday in cash, in 5 minutes, just showed my i.c. and handed over the old tag.