PDA

View Full Version : Malaysian Cantonese is corrupted



ng
19-09-2015, 11:29 AM
I constantly hear corrupted Cantonese in Malaysia, I usually laugh when I hear them. Today I am going to point out the various common errors.

1. Money

'Lui' is from Malay 'duit' because Chinese can't pronounce the 'd' consonant in the past, it's approximated to 'L'.


2. All

'Sama' is from Malay 'semua'. Again it is a corruption of the word 'semua'.


3. Market

Pasar is a Malay word which was borrowed from 'Bazaar'.


4. Don't want anything added to your drinks/food

'Kosong' is a misuse of the word empty. Empty should mean no rice, no noodles, nothing.


5. Police

'Mata/Matau' is from Malay word 'mata-mata'.


6. Eat here or take-away

'Sik' 'Ta pau'. Sik simply means eat. It doesn't mean 'eat', it doesn't mean 'I am having my food here'. If you take-away to eat, it also means 'eat'.


7. Cuttlefish

'Sotong' is a Malay word.


8. Number of times.

'Bai' is a Hokkien word and not Cantonese.


9. Boring

'Sien' is a Hokkien word.


If you go to Hong Kong or China, they won't understand you if you use these words. So if anyone can give me the correct Cantonese phrases, I will mark it later.

There are also many English words injected into Malaysian Cantonese but those don't need any explanations from me.

Naka
19-09-2015, 12:13 PM
QUOTE=ng;596853]I constantly hear corrupted Cantonese in Malaysia, I usually laugh when I hear them. Today I am going to point out the various common errors.

1. Money

'Lui' is from Malay 'duit' because Chinese can't pronounce the 'd' consonant in the past, it's approximated to 'L'.


Cantonese is "chen"


2. All

'Sama' is from Malay 'semua'. Again it is a corruption of the word 'semua'.

Cantonese is "Ngo Di"


3. Market

Pasar is a Malay word which was borrowed from 'Bazaar'.

Cantonese is "Kai Sei"


4. Don't want anything added to your drinks/food

'Kosong' is a misuse of the word empty. Empty should mean no rice, no noodles, nothing.

Cantonese is "Hung"


5. Police

'Mata/Matau' is from Malay word 'mata-mata'.

Cantonese is " Ken Chat" or "Chai yen" or "ah sir"


6. Eat here or take-away

'Sik' 'Ta pau'. Sik simply means eat. It doesn't mean 'eat', it doesn't mean 'I am having my food here'. If you take-away to eat, it also means 'eat'.

Cantonese is "Ngo mai"



7. Cuttlefish

'Sotong' is a Malay word.

Cantonese is "Yau yee"


8. Number of times.

'Bai' is a Hokkien word and not Cantonese.

Cantonese is "Chee"


9. Boring

'Sien' is a Hokkien word.

Cantonese is "Hung mun"


If you go to Hong Kong or China, they won't understand you if you use these words. So if anyone can give me the correct Cantonese phrases, I will mark it later.

There are also many English words injected into Malaysian Cantonese but those don't need any explanations from me.[/QUOTE

That's how the Honkies speak:D

Firefly
19-09-2015, 02:37 PM
Naka, are you chinese?? Always thought you were an indian. :eek:

Naka
19-09-2015, 03:09 PM
Naka, are you chinese?? Always thought you were an indian. :eek:

Hehehehe, Cantonese lah.....:D

ng
19-09-2015, 04:10 PM
That's how the Honkies speak:D

Nice try but...

2, 4, 6 are wrong.

9. What is 'Hung Mun'? It should be 'moon' (boring) or 'hou moon' (very boring).

Naka
19-09-2015, 04:25 PM
Nice try but...

2, 4, 6 are wrong.

9. What is 'Hung Mun'? It should be 'moon' (boring) or 'hou moon' (very boring).

2. All

'Sama' is from Malay 'semua'. Again it is a corruption of the word 'semua'.

Cantonese is "Ngo Di"......I took 'sama' as 'we'...therefore, "ngo di" is correct.

4. Don't want anything added to your drinks/food

'Kosong' is a misuse of the word empty. Empty should mean no rice, no noodles, nothing.

Cantonese is "Hung".....if you think it's wrong..:eek:..what is your translation?:confused:


6. Eat here or take-away

'Sik' 'Ta pau'. Sik simply means eat. It doesn't mean 'eat', it doesn't mean 'I am having my food here'. If you take-away to eat, it also means 'eat'.

Cantonese is "Ngo mai"....sorry I mistook your question, I thought you said "Tak Pou"...........anyway if you said it's wrong, why do you say so?:D

9.....My "Hung Mun" is actual Hongkie slang.....same meaning as "hou moon"

Why do you think my Hongkie Cantonese is wrong?

currymee
19-09-2015, 06:47 PM
hahaha ... as far as I am concerned, as long as MY MALAYSIAN HAWKERS UNDERSTAND what I want, ALL IS WELL !! :D :D

bslee
19-09-2015, 10:26 PM
I guessed as much as someone would stand up and claim its perfectly all right.. nevermind all the flaws.
Its the same when anyone still insist status quo speaking Manglish and Singlish, whatever glish...
As long as its not SMS language.. I x read..XOXO! LOL!

jan tomaswaki
20-09-2015, 12:20 AM
I guessed as much as someone would stand up and claim its perfectly all right.. nevermind all the flaws.
Its the same when anyone still insist status quo speaking Manglish and Singlish, whatever glish...
As long as its not SMS language.. I x read..XOXO! LOL!

What about raining " lok suey" or " lok yee "

bslee
20-09-2015, 12:39 AM
What about raining " lok suey" or " lok yee "

Errr...don't ask me..I'm no Cantonese nor cultured from young with the dialect. I try best to communicate based on what I have learnt, and hopefully its easily understood by the other, don't sound offensive or asking to be laughed at.

Naka
20-09-2015, 07:19 AM
What about raining " lok suey" or " lok yee "

Lok yee is spoken by all Hongkies

currymee
20-09-2015, 08:53 AM
And why the impression that HK people speaks correct or definitive Cantonese ? Anyone who calls the police "AH SIR" .... is definitely not using pure Cantonese hahahaha ... just Hong Kong Cantonese ....

So, what is wrong with Malaysian or KL Cantonese ?

Think about it .... :p

mick123
20-09-2015, 09:32 AM
#4 is actually "jai" not hung....so like if you want mee and nothing else, it's jai mein :) or most often we hear "ching" mein

also how do we say the colour purple and brown here ;)

Naka
20-09-2015, 10:40 AM
And why the impression that HK people speaks correct or definitive Cantonese ? Anyone who calls the police "AH SIR" .... is definitely not using pure Cantonese hahahaha ... just Hong Kong Cantonese ....

So, what is wrong with Malaysian or KL Cantonese ?

Think about it .... :p

"Ah sir" by Hongkies is a Hongkie's slang.

ng said 'Malaysian Cantonese is corrupted !' that's why:D

Naka
20-09-2015, 10:43 AM
BTW, "Tak Pou" is foreign to Hongkies.:cool:

They say "Ngo mai"

bslee
20-09-2015, 12:26 PM
I think HK dialect is also tainted with various words derived from English and maybe others. Like us, they have their own lingo and preferences of what they insist on doing.

jan tomaswaki
20-09-2015, 02:26 PM
BTW, "Tak Pou" is foreign to Hongkies.:cool:

They say "Ngo mai"

Cannot say tak pou,Hongkies means die

Naka
20-09-2015, 02:40 PM
Cannot say tak pou,Hongkies means die

Hahahaha, true, true.:D

jan tomaswaki
20-09-2015, 02:58 PM
mata mata word comes during the Emergency period when most chinese do not understand Malay.When the British went inside the new villages the show them their eyes "mata" means look out for communist and report to them.That is why the word mata comes from.

Naka
20-09-2015, 03:01 PM
mata mata word comes during the Emergency period when most chinese do not understand Malay.When the British went inside the new villages the show them their eyes "mata" means look out for communist and report to them.That is why the word mata comes from.

All the times, I tot mata2 is polis:eek:

jan tomaswaki
20-09-2015, 03:16 PM
All the times, I tot mata2 is polis:eek:

it only comes during emergency time drom1948-60.So the mat salleh tells the chinese to report to the malay police,that's when the chinese call the police mata or matau.Nowadays they call "pak keot" aka traffic police.

Naka
20-09-2015, 03:25 PM
it only comes during emergency time drom1948-60.So the mat salleh tells the chinese to report to the malay police,that's when the chinese call the police mata or matau.Nowadays they call "pak keot" aka traffic police.


TQVM for your info:p

In Sabah, mata2 is polis

ng
21-09-2015, 12:29 PM
2. All


4. Don't want anything added to your drinks/food



6. Eat here or take-away


Why do you think my Hongkie Cantonese is wrong?


My internet was down for few days.

2. Actually, there're several words for 'All' in Cantonese depending on context but the simplest to use is 'Dou' 都.

They are all policemen = Kuei dei dou hai chaai yan. and not 'Kuei dei sama hai matau' (wrong).


4. Actually, 'Kosong' is misused by the Chinese community in Malaysia. It is not even correct in Malay.

It should be 'min yuk' (meatless) 免肉 or 'jaai min' 齋麵 i.e. just plain noodles. 'Kosong' means your plate is empty i.e. no rice, no noodles, no meat and no vege. That is why I laughed when people asked me 'do you want kosong?. :laugh:


6.

To eat inside the restaurant is 'thong sik' 堂食 and not 'sik'. 'Sik' just mean 'to eat'. Where do you eat? Inside the shop or at home?

To take-away can be 'ta pau' 打包 or 'ngoi mai' 外賣. 'ngoi mai' is more for home delivery (restaurant deliver food to customers). Both are usable depending on context. 'Ta pau' doesn't mean 'death', it means I want to take away the food. I've heard it used in HK/China videos to mean 'take away to eat '.

ng
21-09-2015, 12:36 PM
What about raining " lok suey" or " lok yee "

The proper term is 'lok yu' but 'lok sui' is understood by some people from China but with a pause to process what you are actually trying to say.

'Lok sui' actually means 'go/dip into the water' eg. swimming pool or pond.

ng
21-09-2015, 12:39 PM
"Ah sir" by Hongkies is a Hongkie's slang.

ng said 'Malaysian Cantonese is corrupted !' that's why:D

Ah sir is remnants of the British colony era where they address their superior by the title 'sir'.It's an English word.

Anyway, chaai yan (informal) or king chaat (formal) are used together in HK.

bslee
21-09-2015, 12:45 PM
Ah sir is remnants of the British colony era where they address their superior as title 'sir'.It's an English word. It's not a substitute for chaai yan.
Anyway, chaai yan (informal) or king chaat (formal) are still used in HK.

I heard some people speaking these words back in the 80's. I presumed they absorbed it from consistent watching of TVB serial movies which glued many to the tube at 6pm onwards.
All about being influenced.

ng
21-09-2015, 01:19 PM
also how do we say the colour purple and brown here ;)

The proper word for purple is 'Ji Sik'.

Brown color is not standardised, there are several words we can use i.e. 'Fe sik' (coffee color), 'Cha sik' (tea color) or 'Jung sik' (oil palm color).

If you say 'kha fe sik' or 'cha sik' in Malaysia and HK, people will understand you but not 'jung sik' in Malaysia.

jan tomaswaki
21-09-2015, 01:35 PM
The proper word for purple is 'Ji Sik'.

Brown color is not standardised, there are several words we can use i.e. 'Fe sik' (coffee color), 'Cha sik' (tea color) or 'Jung sik' (oil palm color).

If you say 'kha fe sik' or 'cha sik' in Malaysia and HK, people will understand you but not 'jung sik' in Malaysia.

What about pineapple? we call wong lai but in HK call por long izzit?

bslee
21-09-2015, 01:45 PM
I learn all sorts of lingo, terms and words every now and then..mistakes, flaws, wrong altogether all part of the learning process. I'm a banana..I admit it..as long as the other understand what I'm trying to say. Mandarin is still Greek to me.
When I was in SZH, Guangzhou..realised only locals spoke Cantonese. Others all in Mandarin..as those cities are highly developed cosmopolitan cities..people from every corner of China maybe earning a living there.
Whatever it may be... I'm FIRM to NEVER TO SPEAK FOUL Chinese words in any conversation. If those foul words are used, it just show uncouth and uncivilized behavior.

Naka
21-09-2015, 02:31 PM
To take-away can be 'ta pau' 打包 or 'ngoi mai' 外賣. 'ngoi mai' is more for home delivery (restaurant deliver food to customers). Both are usable depending on context........... I've heard it used in HK/China videos to mean 'take away to eat '.

I say, ng, you are really confused now.:rolleyes:

In this thread you are saying "corrupted Cantonese" and it is not Cantonese that is understandable.

2 different issues here.

"Ta Pau" is Malaysian and it is not Hongkie Cantonese.

People in HK or China may understand your "corrupted Cantonese" but that do not mean you are speaking proper Cantonese.

Can you see the difference? If not, I can't help you anymore.:cool:

Naka
21-09-2015, 02:45 PM
To take-away can be 'ta pau' 打包 or 'ngoi mai' 外賣. 'ngoi mai' is more for home delivery (restaurant deliver food to customers)............. 'Ta pau' doesn't mean 'death', it means I want to take away the food. I've heard it used in HK/China videos to mean 'take away to eat '.

I tried to amend my last post #30 but this is what came out.....3797

What I wanted to say to you is this, you learnt it from "VIDEOS"....this is laughing matter.

Aiya, go and see for your self how people say proper Cantonese lah:D

bslee
21-09-2015, 02:48 PM
Question is..is HK cantonese, cantonese proper? I don't think it is at this point of time, maybe not as I presume it. There's difference between how Cantonese is spoken by famed actors Shek Kin and Steven Chow..

https://youtu.be/V7AEEEF0geI

currymee
21-09-2015, 02:57 PM
What I am puzzled is WHY the sudden fascination to seek out "pure" Cantonese ? It does not exist anymore just like in all other languages, there are local/regional variations and constantly evolving vocabulary and pronunciations as people mix from around the world.

Unless you want to alleviate HK Cantonese as the GOLD REFERENCE STANDARD but then again, it begs the question "Do you plan to live in HK or KL ? "

When in Rome, do as the Romans do .... why speak Hongkie Canto when you are in Malaysia ?

Just like people speaking the Queen's Standard Reference English with Oxford pronunciation, people will think you are a snob or misfit !

Just thinking aloud, no right or wrong.

bslee
21-09-2015, 03:05 PM
Mr Currymee..I setuju what you've said. Its the logical and pragmatic approach.
Hahah...sorry if sound farnie..Maybe trying to be more "Chinese" than those in the Middle Kingdom?.. lol!
All I know or gather is you go there, they don't regard you as Chinese..but Malai yen..or Malai....

ng
21-09-2015, 03:34 PM
Aiya, go and see for your self how people say proper Cantonese lah:D

That is proper Cantonese, I've been speaking Cantonese for decades and have also been watching Cantonese videos for decades. I used to have HK friends during my university days.

As for the video part, there was some controversy with this so what better way then to confirm from listening carefully to Cantonese videos from China and HK, and surprise! they do use 'Ta pau'. Ta pau actually means 'bring back the leftover food' when you eat in a restaurant.

Ngoi mai has a slightly different meaning, it usually means 'home delivery' so both of these terms are used in HK and China.

Ta pau is not corrupted. It's the 'sik' that is corrupted.

You can ask some HK people in Australia if you are still confused. If not, buy an air-ticket to HK. :D

ng
21-09-2015, 03:46 PM
What I am puzzled is WHY the sudden fascination to seek out "pure" Cantonese ? .

It's just like saying why learn 'Queen's English' in school with all the proper grammar, vocabulary and spelling.

Why not just learn Manglish with its broken grammar, Malay words, Chinese grammar etc. After all, people can still understand terrible broken English in Malaysia. eg. You makan already or not? e.g. why you so lansi?

But those people who tried to communicate with native English speakers usually find out that native English speakers don't understand what you're saying. They don't think it's proper English.

So if you want to visit English speaking countries, you need to speak proper English.

If you want to go to HK or Guangzhou, then you need to speak proper Cantonese to be understood.
Unless you intend to use other languages to communicate.

Once you're used to broken English or broken Cantonese, it's very difficult to correct it in your later years. I have to consciously remove all my Manglish when I went to university abroad and it was easier then because I was still young. Imagine how difficult it is when you are much older.

Naka
21-09-2015, 03:53 PM
That is proper Cantonese, I've been speaking Cantonese for decades and have also been watching Cantonese videos for decades. I used to have HK friends during my university days.

As for the video part, there was some controversy with this so what better way then to confirm from listening carefully to Cantonese videos from China and HK, and surprise! they do use 'Ta pau'. Ta pau actually means 'bring back the leftover food' when you eat in a restaurant.

Ngoi mai has a slightly different meaning, it usually means 'home delivery' so both of these terms are used in HK and China.

Ta pau is not corrupted. It's the 'sik' that is corrupted.

You can ask some HK people in Australia if you are still confused. If not, buy an air-ticket to HK. :D

Come on, I live in HK for a few months in a year.

jan tomaswaki
21-09-2015, 04:00 PM
ng, try telling your senior love ones whether they want to ta pau food on the first day of CNY.They will use the "kuat tou soh par " to wack you:heheheh::heheheh:

ng
21-09-2015, 06:46 PM
Come on, I live in HK for a few months in a year.

If you live in HK for a few months a year, then with all due respect why is it that you can't answer some of the questions raised here?

Just because you only hear 'ngoi mai' being spoken doesn't mean 'ta pau' can't be used too.
'Ngoi mai' is more commonly spoken in HK but 'ta pau' is not wrong too.


As what i've said the original meaning of 'ta pau' is to 'take-away back the leftover food that you can't finish eating in a restaurant'.

However, I saw a show filmed in Guangdong province whereby the actor who is a true-blue China born Cantonese asked his friend to wait in line to buy lunch-box from a mobile hawker and he used the word 'ta pau' so that word is quite acceptable too.

Anyway, I am not going to argue anymore on this minor point. We agree to disagree then.:D

Naka
22-09-2015, 07:01 AM
If you live in HK for a few months a year, then with all due respect why is it that you can't answer some of the questions raised here?

Just because you only hear 'ngoi mai' being spoken doesn't mean 'ta pau' can't be used too.
'Ngoi mai' is more commonly spoken in HK but 'ta pau' is not wrong too.


As what i've said the original meaning of 'ta pau' is to 'take-away back the leftover food that you can't finish eating in a restaurant'.

However, I saw a show filmed in Guangdong province whereby the actor who is a true-blue China born Cantonese asked his friend to wait in line to buy lunch-box from a mobile hawker and he used the word 'ta pau' so that word is quite acceptable too.

Anyway, I am not going to argue anymore on this minor point. We agree to disagree then.:D

Best to leave it as such.:D

Firefly
22-09-2015, 10:01 AM
Take away would be ngoi mai (direct translation would be "sell outside" as Ngoi = out and mai = sell) You can also say ling cau (with ling = bring and cau = go)
If you are in a restaurant and you cannot finish the food, then it can be Pau hei. My Cantonese is a tat limited but with many trips there, I can get away with it :D

But the best and purest translation would be pure mandarin. Same way as it's written but read in cantonese.

Chia Hak Soon
22-09-2015, 11:09 AM
What about the common word " Shoik " ? cantonese, hokkien , or teo chew. ?

ng
22-09-2015, 09:21 PM
What about the common word " Shoik " ? cantonese, hokkien , or teo chew. ?


I don't understand your pinyin. Can you explain more.

kwchang
22-09-2015, 11:08 PM
What about the common word " Shoik " ? cantonese, hokkien , or teo chew. ?
Neither... if you actually meant "shiok" then it just a Manglish word derived from the English "shock"
Just an expression of delight, ecstacy, satisfaction - I believe you see this expression on Astro where Singapore is promoting their 50th independence year. I don't agree it is a Singlish word.... more regional. It is also used in Malay...hence is not really local Chinese

ng
22-09-2015, 11:37 PM
Neither... if you actually meant "shiok" then it just a Manglish word derived from the English "shock"
Just an expression of delight, ecstacy, satisfaction - I believe you see this expression on Astro where Singapore is promoting their 50th independence year. I don't agree it is a Singlish word.... more regional. It is also used in Malay...hence is not really local Chinese


kwchang is correct. Shiok actually comes from Malay slang which was originally borrowed from English 'Shock'.

ng
22-09-2015, 11:47 PM
Take away would be ngoi mai (direct translation would be "sell outside" as Ngoi = out and mai = sell) You can also say ling cau (with ling = bring and cau = go)
If you are in a restaurant and you cannot finish the food, then it can be Pau hei. My Cantonese is a tat limited but with many trips there, I can get away with it :D

But the best and purest translation would be pure mandarin. Same way as it's written but read in cantonese.

I can give the Chinese characters as well.

All these can be used as synonyms but with slightly different meanings.

'Pau hei lei' 包起來 is equivalent to 'Ta pau' 打包. It just mean 'pack the food in a paper or box'.

'Ling Jau' 拎走 just mean 'bring away' the food and the waiter will know what to do i.e. pack the food or else how can you take the food away.


Coincidentally, I just watched a Cantonese show from China today. The cook was buying groceries in a supermarket and asked the seller to 'ta pau' the vegetables. So it's confirmed that this phrase is used in China too.

Ngoi mai has a slightly different meaning from 'ta pau'.

Firefly
23-09-2015, 09:11 AM
I think that ngoi mai should rightfully be use if it's from the waiter to the cook. So the cook need not put it onto a plate but straight into a container.

kwchang
23-09-2015, 10:50 AM
Let's get this straight...Ngoi Mai is used for takeaway order of food like for example home delivery of pizza (hope I am right here). The word "mai" is a sale...hence an order for delivery, not a dine-in issue. Therefore if you couldn't finish the food, I doubt you should say Ngoi Mai to the waiter - try it and let me know the waiter's expression after you said it, haha

ng
23-09-2015, 12:35 PM
Let's get this straight...Ngoi Mai is used for takeaway order of food like for example home delivery of pizza (hope I am right here). The word "mai" is a sale...hence an order for delivery, not a dine-in issue. Therefore if you couldn't finish the food, I doubt you should say Ngoi Mai to the waiter - try it and let me know the waiter's expression after you said it, haha


kwchang is correct.

Like what I said, the meanings of the different words are slightly different but the end result is the same i.e. the food is taken away to eat at home.

When we are physically there at the shop and we are lining up for the 'mixed rice', we can say 'ta pau' because we are choosing from the 30 selection of food and packing them up in a small polystyrene box. This word can also be used when we visit supermarkets to buy groceries like what I saw yesterday.

When we are calling to the restaurant from home, we usually use 'ngoi mai'. This is a home delivery order.

ng
23-09-2015, 12:54 PM
On to the last set of common corruptions, let's see who can get these correct.

1. Clam

Clam is spoken as 'lala' in Malaysia, but it's not the same in HK and China.

2. Silent

Malaysian use 'diam-diam' which is actually borrowed from Malay.

3. Ownself

As in 'do it yourself'.

Malaysian use 'ka ki' which is actually a Hokkien word

4. Easy

Malaysian use 'si nang' which is actually from Malay word 'senang'.

5. Good at/well

eg. You can talk well. 'Nei kong wa hou pa-nai'

Pa-nai is from Malay word 'Pandai'.

6. itchy

I was shocked to hear 'geli' used by someone I met last week.

'Geli' is a Malay word.

7. Night market

Pasar malam is a malay word.

8. Ask for help

'Tolong' is a malay word.

bslee
23-09-2015, 02:57 PM
From my common logic and whatever I could pick out when Malaysian Chinese speak Mandarin or any other local dialects, the accent, speed and pronunciation is different in varying degrees to what I observe of Chinese at HK, Taiwan, Mainland China. In short and can conclude, Malaysian Chinese speak differently and uniquely Malaysian in tone and accent.
Was watching a Youtube clip..Cantonese happened to be among top 10 hardest language. 9 tones out of 4 compared to Mandarin and the written Cantonese word may not match what is said.

Naka
23-09-2015, 03:26 PM
On to the last set of common corruptions, let's see who can get these correct.

1. Clam

Clam is spoken as 'lala' in Malaysia, but it's not the same in HK and China.

2. Silent

Malaysian use 'diam-diam' which is actually borrowed from Malay.

3. Ownself

As in 'do it yourself'.

Malaysian use 'ka ki' which is actually a Hokkien word

4. Easy

Malaysian use 'si nang' which is actually from Malay word 'senang'.

5. Good at/well

eg. You can talk well. 'Nei kong wa hou pa-nai'

Pa-nai is from Malay word 'Pandai'.

6. itchy

I was shocked to hear 'geli' used by someone I met last week.

'Geli' is a Malay word.

7. Night market

Pasar malam is a malay word.

8. Ask for help

'Tolong' is a malay word.

These 8 items are not Cantonese at all:D

bslee
23-09-2015, 05:48 PM
These 8 items are not Cantonese at all:D

There's countless things in Malaysia that "are not right" but already cultured or set as a norm in this era.
Even at USA, numerous variants and accents in spoken English Language but nevertheless, its all accepted as long as there's no offence or insult.
I'm a firm subscriber to being pragmatic, practical and a realist rather than egoistic about my origins or to emulate them. Just be myself...banana or not...LOL!

P.S..speaking about bananas...bananas KW Chang brought over that night..a delicious munch!...:heheheh:

ng
23-09-2015, 10:42 PM
These 8 items are not Cantonese at all:D

The problem is that the Cantonese language standard in Malaysia is so low that most people don't know the real Cantonese words.

These two sets are the most common corruption that I have found.

ng
23-09-2015, 11:25 PM
These 8 items are not Cantonese at all:D

I don't even want to go into the long list of English loan words into Malaysian Cantonese but these are restricted to non-Chinese educated Malaysians only.

Most of the Chinese educated won't use the English loan words such as 'but, or, then' that has crept into some Malaysian Cantonese speakers.

Naka
24-09-2015, 06:39 AM
The problem is that the Cantonese language standard in Malaysia is so low that most people don't know the real Cantonese words.

These two sets are the most common corruption that I have found.

Agreed, to me, I like to term it as "Pasar Cantonese":D

Naka
24-09-2015, 06:41 AM
There's countless things in Malaysia that "are not right" but already cultured or set as a norm in this era.
Even at USA, numerous variants and accents in spoken English Language but nevertheless, its all accepted as long as there's no offence or insult.
I'm a firm subscriber to being pragmatic, practical and a realist rather than egoistic about my origins or to emulate them. Just be myself...banana or not...LOL!

P.S..speaking about bananas...bananas KW Chang brought over that night..a delicious munch!...:heheheh:

Must be from his plantation.

ng
26-09-2015, 04:36 PM
Nobody has answered the second set of questions?
I'll start the ball rolling.

1. Lala is called 'Fa Gaap' in HK.

So next time you go to HK, you know what to say.

bslee
26-09-2015, 07:01 PM
Was chatting with my friend, who is pure Cantonese (malaysian of course lah).... He affirmed, pack and take away is "lor chau"..not ling chau.
I'm not Cantonese of course..I'm learning anyhow. At least now I know not to simply speak "tar pow" any old how..

ng
27-09-2015, 12:36 AM
Was chatting with my friend, who is pure Cantonese (malaysian of course lah).... He affirmed, pack and take away is "lor chau"..not ling chau.
I'm not Cantonese of course..I'm learning anyhow. At least now I know not to simply speak "tar pow" any old how..

This may come as a surprise to you but the standard of Cantonese in Malaysia is of primary one to three standard for those who are non Chinese-educated. So it's extremely low and only used for very ordinary everyday situations.

There are more than one synonyms for one meaning. Lor chau and ling chau are both valid.
Lor Chau is more common in Malaysia and Ling chau is more common in HK. However, HK people also can understand Lor Chau.

Don't tell me that you can only say one word for English and there are no synonyms?

ng
16-12-2015, 09:42 PM
By the way, I can upload a video on one restaurant in Guangzhou who are true blue Cantonese who said:


Ta pau - take away
Hai nei tou sik - dine in


So it is confirmed without a doubt, Ta Pau is not a Malaysian term. I just watched another Cantonese documentary video yesterday filmed in China.

Naka
17-12-2015, 08:17 AM
By the way, I can upload a video on one restaurant in Guangzhou who are true blue Cantonese who said:


Ta pau - take away
Hai nei tou sik - dine in


So it is confirmed without a doubt, Ta Pau is not a Malaysian term. I just watched another Cantonese documentary video yesterday filmed in China.

True Hongkies understand you if you say "Ta Pau" a food.

But they do not speak such a word.

There is a difference between "UNDERSTANDING & SPEAKING"

Video is for entertainment and can be anything.

ng
17-12-2015, 08:44 AM
True Hongkies understand you if you say "Ta Pau" a food.




It's not for entertainment.

It's a documentary of a famous shop doing its normal business in Guangzhou, China. Many customers there were interviewed regarding the food there and the shop workers were doing its normal daily work while being filmed.

It was spoken by a true blue Cantonese at the counter selling the food. This is not 'understanding'.

Naka
17-12-2015, 08:58 AM
It's not for entertainment.

It's a documentary of a famous shop doing its normal business in Guangzhou, China. Many customers there were interviewed regarding the food there and the shop workers were doing its normal daily work while being filmed.

It was spoken by a true blue Cantonese at the counter selling the food. This is not 'understanding'.

Ng, say what you like, you are entitled to your observation.

This is not how Hongkies speak here in Hong Kong.

My opinion......It is rude!

ng
23-12-2015, 08:54 PM
Ng, say what you like, you are entitled to your observation.



I am 100% sure as I study languages in depth.


'Ta pau' means 'pack the food home' when you're physically at the shop.

'Ngoi mai' means you phone up the shop and they do a 'home delivery' to you.


Both terms are used in China/HK but the meaning is different for the two terms.

QuietStorm
28-12-2015, 10:06 PM
So it is confirmed without a doubt, Ta Pau is not a Malaysian term. I just watched another Cantonese documentary video yesterday filmed in China.My friend is in Hong Kong for a holiday. I have asked her to run a check with the locals. Will report back once I hear from her. Btw, she says Hongkies are damn rude people and those in Macau, especially. Hmmm.

bslee
28-12-2015, 10:27 PM
Btw, she says Hongkies are damn rude people and those in Macau, especially. Hmmm.

Heard that many times before..they can't be all wrong.

ng
29-12-2015, 10:10 AM
My friend is in Hong Kong for a holiday. I have asked her to run a check with the locals. Will report back once I hear from her. Btw, she says Hongkies are damn rude people and those in Macau, especially. Hmmm.

I have been to HK once, they are not any ruder than the local Chinese.

If you are there to 'look-see', you're not welcome. They are very realistic people.

Naka
29-12-2015, 02:48 PM
I have been to HK once, they are not any ruder than the local Chinese.

If you are there to 'look-see', you're not welcome. They are very realistic people.

Yes, that was in the 70s & 80s.

During the SARS scare a few years back, businesses were really bad so much so arrival of tourists were the lowest.

Every night on TVs for a few months, famous HK Film Stars lectured business men in HK how to talk & response. It works wonder.

These days, younger businessmen & staffs are really polite these days.

Walk in, they say "welcome"

Walk out, they say "thank you" even if you do not buy anything.

bslee
29-12-2015, 03:10 PM
As for here, speaking about LCLY, arrogance or rudeness in the business sector, I guess much have changed, maybe they've learnt a lesson or 2 when their business is not as good or going downhill. Only then they become more responsive, a bit friendlier and with some good courtesy greeting customers. This is from my experience all over the decades visiting mostly Chinese run businesses at Jalan Pasar electronics road. In the 90's they look up and down at you if you're a genuine customer or not..their pose is stone cold, You want? you buy, you don't buy? they don't give a shit, there will be others will buy, you try bargaining, they can even walk away..that much aloof!.. now at least they say can I help you or hello sir..some good courtesy. I like to go to one shop near Pasar Road. Excellent service and courtesy, don't matter you buy RM5 or RM1 worth. For me, always one staff solely at my service (if not busy) to handle and pick all those bits I need to buy and total up the bill. Its great, just like having a personal waiter at your leisure and service. I hand pick up items by myself like a supermarket and the staff wait at the side..how nice. This is one place I speak Canto and try to improve my language in practice. I like learning the dialect in this manner..practice makes perfect..haha!

ng
29-12-2015, 04:22 PM
I like to go to one shop near Pasar Road. Excellent service and courtesy, don't matter you buy RM5 or RM1 worth.

Please tell us what is the exact name of the shop. It's rare to find such service.

bslee
29-12-2015, 04:25 PM
NIXIE ELECTRONICS (M) SDN BHD
No. 34 & 36 Jalan Landak Pudu 55100 Kuala Lumpur Malaysia Tel: 603-2148 3277, 2148 3281. Fax: 603-2148 5690, 2148 4873
Opposite Pudu Plaza. You can get there easily by Star LRT, at Pudu station. I go by LRT always. Parking at Pudu Plaza also do..not expensive.

You buy electronic parts? They are a specialty electronics parts store. Neighmind, opposite got Mr DIY..LOL!

QuietStorm
29-12-2015, 05:27 PM
About the Hong Kong 'rude' experience. Well, I was there in the mid 80's. I do recall that generally the pasar malam sellers in Lui Yan Kai in particular were rude. Got told off when I asked for the price of an item but decided not to buy as it was priced too steeply. Having said that when I went back sometime in 2001, things were different. People were decidedly friendlier thanks to a courtesy campaign launched by the government; this according to our tour guide. He was a fun chap, witty and fun. He sounded like a character from one of those TVB series. :laugh: . Too bad Facebook was not available then...we lost touch.

Now, fast forward to 2015. Hmm..I dunno lah. Haven't been back in ages. My friend who is coming back today says "rude". Naka says 'polite'. Maybe I should make a trip there and find out for myself eh? Damn, miss the 1ton mee there!

Going by my friend's experience in Hong Kong, they don't say "ta-pau" but "ling chow". On a few occasions my buddy told the waiter she wanted to "tapau" food back, he would give her a puzzled look and inquired if she had wanted to "ling chow".

ng
29-12-2015, 05:46 PM
Now, fast forward to 2015. Hmm..I dunno lah. Haven't been back in ages. My friend who is coming back today says "rude". Naka says 'polite'. Maybe I should make a trip there and find out for myself eh? Damn, miss the 1ton mee there!

Going by my friend's experience in Hong Kong, they don't say "ta-pau" but "ling chow". On a few occasions my buddy told the waiter she wanted to "tapau" food back, he would give her a puzzled look and inquired if she had wanted to "ling chow".


'Ling Chau' just means 'take away'.

The correct way is to say 'Ta pau faan hui sik' and then they will understand. You can't just say 'ta pau' alone. It just means 'pack up home to eat'.

Having said that, the videos I have watched who used 'Ta pau' was in Guangzhou. Maybe they use slightly different terms in HK and Guangzhou.

In Malaysia, the Cantonese here are all corrupted and sentences are not formed properly. That's why when Malaysians go overseas, they bring their 'corrupted Cantonese' abroad.

QuietStorm
29-12-2015, 06:07 PM
...the videos I have watched who used 'Ta pau' was in Guangzhou. Maybe they use slightly different terms in HK and Guangzhou.I'd reckon so, yes. :D

QuietStorm
29-12-2015, 11:21 PM
In Malaysia, the Cantonese here are all corrupted and sentences are not formed properly. That's why when Malaysians go overseas, they bring their 'corrupted Cantonese' abroad.That is why it is advisable to speak in English when in Hong Kong, at least when you are shopping. If they don't know you are not local, they may not dare to fleece you :grin2: The moment Malaysian Chinese speak in Cantonese, Hongkies will know we are just a bunch of "mar-lei-chais' and are quite ready for the 'slaughter'! :D

ng
30-12-2015, 11:38 AM
That is why it is advisable to speak in English when in Hong Kong, at least when you are shopping. If they don't know you are not local, they may not dare to fleece you :grin2: The moment Malaysian Chinese speak in Cantonese, Hongkies will know we are just a bunch of "mar-lei-chais' and are quite ready for the 'slaughter'! :D


I try not to speak Malaysian Cantonese when I am in Malaysia because this would be automatic corruption programming for my brain so I speak only pure Cantonese.

Sometimes, when I try to correct fellow Msians on their Cantonese, they will look at me like I am an alien :rolleyes:. Eg. the 'kosong' Malay word which is widely misused in restaurants.

When I go to HK or China in the future, I will use proper 100% Cantonese and not the 'rojak' Cantonese here.

You'll get fleeced even if you speak English because you're classified as a foreigner.

bslee
30-12-2015, 12:01 PM
I try not to speak Malaysian Cantonese when I am in Malaysia because this would be automatic corruption programming for my brain so I speak only pure Cantonese.
Its always a good practice to speak any language properly AND without uncouth words. Of course if you think its already proper. As for others may always think what they speak is already proper and there's dispute or disagreement by others who think they're superior. No harm done..just practice the proper, its good. I too, try my best to learn and practice the correct speech. Fortunately, I have friends happy to correct me whenever I make mistakes.

Charbroiled
31-12-2015, 10:19 AM
Eg. the 'kosong' Malay word which is widely misused in restaurants.Unfortunately, that is easily understood by waiters everywhere in Malaysia. It is a hassle-free, say once command! The correct word is "chai", correct me if I'm wrong. Ng?

ng
31-12-2015, 11:08 AM
Unfortunately, that is easily understood by waiters everywhere in Malaysia. It is a hassle-free, say once command! The correct word is "chai", correct me if I'm wrong. Ng?

To me, 'kosong' means you don't want anything so it's a wrong word to use for Malay too.

The proper usage would be to specify what you don't want. There is no catch-all phrase.

'Jai Min' means just the 'mee and the vegetables' with no meat but you can put the thinly-sliced green onions.

ng
01-01-2016, 08:26 AM
Actually, not only is Malaysian Cantonese corrupted but Malaysian English is also corrupted.

Foreigners have trouble understanding Malaysian/Singaporean English too. Watch this funny video.:D
He's an English teacher and had trouble understanding Hatyai English and Singaporean English.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mr5RxOrmSxw

bslee
01-01-2016, 01:01 PM
I will highly admire and try to practice "received pronunciation (RP)" English. Its proper...period!

ng
01-01-2016, 01:09 PM
I will highly admire and try to practice "received pronunciation (RP)" English. Its proper...period!

A lot of Msians don't realise that they speak broken English and the pronunciation is incorrect.
That's why native English speakers have trouble understanding them.

bslee
01-01-2016, 02:05 PM
A lot of Msians don't realise that they speak broken English and the pronunciation is incorrect.
That's why native English speakers have trouble understanding them.

Anyhow, I just think the standard have seriously deteriorated to the point of inability among much of the population. The next generation who acquire good to great grasp of the English Language are successful in their own right with potentially a brighter future. PERIOD!

ng
10-01-2016, 01:05 AM
Actually, 'go outstation' is not a proper English word. I don't know how it got corrupted here. If you go abroad to western countries, they won't understand you.

Lwd
10-01-2016, 06:16 PM
I read with interest and I am impressed with your confidence and in-depth studies in Chinese/Cantonese and English languages especially your ability to identify and correct the corrupted languages



I am 100% sure as I study languages in depth.

'Ta pau' means 'pack the food home' when you're physically at the shop.

'Ngoi mai' means you phone up the shop and they do a 'home delivery' to you.

Both terms are used in China/HK but the meaning is different for the two terms.



Actually, 'go outstation' is not a proper English word. I don't know how it got corrupted here. If you go abroad to western countries, they won't understand you.


Here is an opportunity that I would like to share with you.. :)

Li Ka Shing, the richest man in HK and one of the richest man in the world with more than US$ 31 billion worth of wealth is looking for someone who is good in languages especially in Chinese. He is offering a pay cheque more than HK$ 1 million a year (about RM580,000) for this job.

Why not give it a try and let your talent shines. Maybe you are the one he is looking for and I believe HK$ 1 million a year will help you to completely forget about the problem of living cost here..

Here is the link... http://dailynews.sina.com/bg/news/int/sinchewdaily/20160109/00397123627.html

ng
10-01-2016, 08:12 PM
Here is an opportunity that I would like to share with you.. :)

Why not give it a try and let your talent shines. Maybe you are the one he is looking for and I believe HK$ 1 million a year will help you to completely forget about the problem of living cost here..



Thanks for the opportunity but I think you've completely misunderstood me or someone has misled you.

I only highlight the rising cost of living affecting the average Malaysian as reported in the newspapers. I am not so selfish to always think about myself. :rolleyes:

Of course, the recent rise in COL is affecting each of us in different ways but it's not serious enough that I have to go begging on the streets. :D I still have a comfortable life.

Another example is I highlighted the few guys who were oppressed by the Lowyat plaza incident but I was definitely not a victim.

ng
11-01-2016, 10:42 AM
Lwd,

It's not that my Chinese is superb. It's just that the standard of Chinese in Malaysia is too low - primary one or two. I see a lot of written and spoken mistakes whenever I go to Chinese restaurants.

For example, the 'Loh Min' is written incorrectly.

Whenever I point out their mistakes, they think I am an alien from outer space. :rolleyes:

A few decades ago, the standard of English was very good but nowadays everytime I speak in basic English to strangers, they reply in Malay.

Lwd
11-01-2016, 11:16 AM
Ng,

I don’t know what to say lah..

It seems like the people you meet whether on the street or at the eateries, chances are they all failed to meet your standard. They are either “funny” because they don’t know the demographics of Malaysia, or they can’t speak proper Chinese, they speak corrupted Cantonese or they can’t communicate in English..

I think you are some kind of high calibre people who has high personal standard. May I suggest you to live in Cambridgeshire, UK. I went there last year and I am sure the command of English of the Brits there will meet your standard. Also, maybe you can try Taipei and Beijing for good command of Mandarin. Please don’t go to Kaohsiung and Shanghai because chances are they will speak Hokkien in Kaohsiung and Shanghainese in Shanghai which I think will upset you again.

Lastly, you can try Sandakan if HK is too far when you wanna find people who speak proper Cantonese.

Hope this helps..



I find it funny that most Malaysians I talked to don't even know the basic demographics of Malaysia..