Someone Recommended Aspirin...???

[Sentinel]

I remember a forumer, it was Richard Poh if I am not mistaken, who recommended we take an aspirin a day to keep heart and cardiac problems away. There were some discussions and debate on this recommendation.

Today there was an article in Yahoo! which I though you should all have a look. It talks about the danger of taking aspirin giving more harm than good.

Read the article HERE (http://health.yahoo.com/news/afp/healthresearchheartbritain_20090831130209.html) .

[ng]

Unlike the average person, my immune system is quite strong.

The last time, I took aspirin, I got an allergic reaction that nearly took my life.
So it is a toxic drug that harms the average body gradually.

I am allergic to any toxic substances even smoke from cigarettes which we now know causes lung cancer.

[zinglicious]

Asiprin is been used for long long time. In fact, probably the most used drug for minor complaints for headches, menstrual and joint pains.( probably taken over by paracetamol which is marketed as panadol or tynelol.
Toxicity, anphylaxis or allergy, side effects and adverse drug reaction is all different set of problems when drugs are given to patients.

Even peanuts or strawberry can kill those who take it if they are hyperallergic to it and it is not even a drug! And many aslo suffered severe reaction from seafood like crabs and shrimp.

Whether aspirin is good or advisable, it is best to be determined and monitored by doctors especially in cardiac failure.This is what we may called the narrow therapeutic index in this context.

Good immune system is not really means that you are weak when you are allergic to certain substances.

[kuma]

Unlike the average person, my immune system is quite strong.

The last time, I took aspirin, I got an allergic reaction that nearly took my life.
So it is a toxic drug that harms the average body gradually.

I am allergic to any toxic substances even smoke from cigarettes which we now know causes lung cancer.

I doubt there is any co-relation between you having a 'strong' immune system and you being allergic to aspirin. I'm curious to know what sort of 'allergy' you get in response to cigarette smoke? Is it when you smoke a cigarette? [which I doubt as you know it causes lung cancer], or when you are in the presence of second hand smoke? Do you break out in rashes?

Aspirin is still one of the best [not forgetting cheapest] anti-inflammatory drug as well as excellent pain killer. It is also an anti-coagulant and there are some studies of late that talk about it's anti-cancer properties, prevention of cataracts and preeclampsia [no medically authenticated yet].

The draw back is those prone to stomach ulcers cant take it, so can't those with bleeding disorders as well as young children.

The article in Yahoo was also featured in the BBC weeks ago. This is sad because Aspirin is a alternative cheap drug for prevention of clots in those with heart and circulatory problems.

There are some other interesting uses as well....Read 10 Surprising Uses for Aspirin (http://gomestic.com/homemaking/10-surprising-uses-for-aspirin/)

[Sentinel]

The article in Yahoo was also featured in the BBC weeks ago. This is sad because Aspirin is a alternative cheap drug for prevention of clots in those with heart and circulatory problems.
Hey Kuma, what is the difference between this aspirin thinghy, sorry for my ignorance, and warfarin which are prescribed for the purpose of blood-thinning in cardio-vascular and blood circulatory patients?

[kuma]

I believe we have a few docs at this Forum who should be able to enlighten us better.....But, anyway, here's my 2 Alka-Seltzer's worth :D [Ah...those good old days...2 Alkas in the morning :D :D ]

Warfarin is a Anticoagulant and Aspirin is an Antiplatelet agent. Both are prescribed to prevent blood from clotting in patients with heart problems. Now without going into the Pharmacokinetics of it all :D :D .....

As we were used too....Warfarin was the choice drug [as per the topic in this Thread]....and what we used to hear people in our parent's time take... prior to Aspirin becoming popular in about the late '70's and more so today.

As per both of these, their usage in the prevention of possible future heart attacks were by accident. Warfarin is a coumarin derivative whose original use was rat poison :( .....and Aspirin's, usage [for heart patients] was also by accident. The ever industrious Americans put Aspirin in Chewing gum and marketed it as an analgesic chewing gum [Don't like to take a Pill?...Hey! Chew This] :D Some doctors were dishing it out and those that took large amounts suddenly had to be hospitalized for severe bleeding.

Which is Better?

I think the debate and 'pharmo-wars' has not been settled.....Here is a good study with clinical stats and a very interesting chart.
Read (http://www.medicine.ox.ac.uk/bandolier/booth/aspirin/waraspmi.html)

[zinglicious]

Warfarin is more favored among UK studies and asiprin is more favorable among US studies. But one thing usually stand out between the studies is usually the munbers of withdrawals which warfarin usually lose out.

[Sentinel]

Warfarin is more favored among UK studies and asiprin is more favorable among US studies. But one thing usually stand out between the studies is usually the munbers of withdrawals which warfarin usually lose out.Sorry Zing, I fail to grasp your explanation, could you be kind enough to elaborate esp the last part about 'the number of withdrawals'?

[zinglicious]

Drug Withdrawal or sexual withdrawal as in coitus interruptus ? Just kidding. :o
In clinical studies, there are many criterias used to determined and evaluate drugs. Among them are the number of patients who choose or force to terminate the treatment half way because of adverse side effects like bleeding or severe CNS complications. In short, they dropouts from the trials. and the clinical paper would minus a point.
Now, there is another withdrawal - called coitus interruptus. Let see.......... :D and this one is dedicated to the RTM Ultraman reporter who do not understand what is ultra vires and yet write the report on Karpal SIngh.

[kuma]

Sorry Zing, I fail to grasp your explanation, could you be kind enough to elaborate esp the last part about 'the number of withdrawals'?

I believe 'zinglicious' was referring to the chart as per the link in my earlier post. Correct me if I'm wrong.

The chart is in reference to study done where almost the same number of patients were given either Aspirin, Warfarin or a combination of both. The 4 year study results showed that Aspirin had the highest rate of 'events', death or another attack and the combination the lowest [see chart]

As for 'withdrawals' shown in chart, the combination had the highest, with Aspirin the lowest. This being patients unwilling to continue and major bleeds, etc. Generally, it showed that major bleeds were more frequent when Warfarin was involved.

Put simply, this particular study showed that although deaths were about the same among all 3 treatment regimes, the composite index as per all events was lowest when Warfarin was combined with Aspirin. Aspirin alone showed a higher amounts of re-infarcts and strokes.

NOW....bear in mind....this is just a study....and like all studies, these results need further study :D ....so Folks if you are on any of these medications, dont go telling your Doc what to do OK.

NEVER, NEVER...take medical [and legal] advice from a Forum. Some of us are just a bunch of insomniacs who have nothing better to do :D :D

[kwchang]

...NEVER, NEVER...take medical [and legal] advice from a Forum. Some of us are just a bunch of insomniacs who have nothing better to :D :D Exactly - in my opinion (and I am not a medical person), taking anything to thin the blood needs a doctor's prescription although asprin is not a prescription drug.

Control of blood pressure needs to be done under a physician's advice because the doctor will monitor your physiological changes under different treatment regimes. Besides their medical and pharmacology knowledge, physicians also need to "titrate" the right dose to suit their patients by adjusting the dose while reviewing their patients' response. Every patient react differently to the drugs and this is where the doctor's prescription becomes an art.

As for "withdrawals" -
New drugs need to follow strict rules of testing before they can be marketed. The last stage would be human trials. During drug trials, the volunteer patients are constantly monitored. If anyone's health moves into dangerous territory, the researcher will need to withdraw the patient from the trial - this is very important because humans are not test animals.

[zinglicious]

IMHO, i see no harm if we discuss with doctors what we believe and what we know. Thier job is to convince us they are awared and have taken that into considerations. Medical is like technology and computer.
Good doctors needs to be updated as more clinical papers and studies are done to justify efficacy and safety. Even newer analgesic needs to be reviewed. I remember that doctors have to rewrite prescription of a new cox inhibitor drug as adverse reaction of deaths were reported in the states 7 years ago.
Back in the 90's when the breast examination and screening public forum was done by Dato Suseela Nair, I remember she telling her doctors and nurses not to disregard traditional treatment seeked by the locals. The patients should not be told off but rather be reassured that many traditional fails to response espeically cancerous cells needs to be removed surgically before spreading to other parts of the body. She said " be good enough to listen to your patients. Otherwise, they may not come to us because they are afraid or shy." We cannot take care of patients if we dont care to listen".

[zinglicious]

On withdrawal context in clinical studies - it may not because it is dangerous or life threatening. Drugs evaluated in clinical paper on withdrawal could be of many reasons- Some patients choose to withdraw because of weight gain or hair loss and etc. This being unacceptable side effects which are not acceptable to patients. The withdrawal is from the patients , not doctors.

However, in new drugs testing or approval, any significant number of deaths reported in human is not just a withdrawal, but cancelation of the new drug unless the drugs are for critical indications like 4th stage of cardiac failures or cancer.

[zinglicious]

And it always pay to get a second professional opnion when you have a medical problem. Doctors can misdiagnosis for a number of reasons - not updated by reading clinical papers, did not ask or listen enough, not attentiive enough to observe and do a proper prognosis,and etc.....

My son which was treated by one doctor in PHILAdelphia was such a professional. I was given an exam questions about 30, ranging from symptoms and diet before he set to make a diagnosis. When I met him, I jokingly ask him the questionaire reminds me of my school exam. His reply was it was eaisier for me to give him the info than him asking my son of a year old. And he went through one question to another before he came up with the diagnosis and prescription.

Finally, it could be greeds! Look at Michael Jackson. He sang Heal the world, but life ended up with doctor who might be charged with manslaughter.

[expat1609]

I personally find it very hard to take any medication, even painkillers i take on very rare occasions, if the pain is getting very hard on me only.
I doubt that taking medication like aspirin (or any other medication) on a daily base, without a doctor and without any particular need, can be any good for me.
Aspirins are still chemicals with all kind of side effects, so why take them just for fun ???

[orchipalar]

Err buddies...if the purpose of using Aspirins is intended for blood thinning...
Orchi thinks it would be wiser to take...a little GARLIC... (http://www.google.com.my/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FGarlic&ei=s6SeSsXNF5iG6AOq0dzFAQ&usg=AFQjCNFcZY1An_BKW-96j_g4lK7msnfiCQ) instead...
as home remedy for that purpose...as well as for minor indigestion problem...

There is a good read about Aspirin...in HERE... (http://www.google.com.my/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FAspirin&ei=gKKeSqPXBMmAkQX8t4DcBA&usg=AFQjCNE54YseYFL9sT3JX7L_IBiWVTmMpA)

For home treatment of minor pains or fever...recommended dosage of Aspirin...or Panadol(Paracetamol... (http://www.google.com.my/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FPanadol&ei=EqOeStqEDMmGkAX5iqHhBA&usg=AFQjCNE4zJXyVNoH1gvD_aDBVrpIl3a7uA)) should be...alright.

Remember always...NOT to mix ANY sorts of clinical or chemical medicine with...the consumption of Alcohol...

But that's just Orchi's talking...it's better to refer such matters in depth with...a Physician...

[maxima]

......one doctor in PHILAdelphia was such a professional. I was given an exam questions about 30, ranging from symptoms and diet before he set to make a diagnosis.........he went through one question to another before he came up with the diagnosis and prescription.




That's a true "scientific" doctor. If our MOH has a sense of that it should enforce that to be a compulsory procedure, instead of merely collecting headcounts of patients of various diseases. :o