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bobkee
04-08-2009, 10:34 AM
.. for those of you who are Teochews like me :D

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Chia Hak Soon
04-08-2009, 11:03 AM
Bob are you a member of the Teochew Association ? I am a pure breed teochew.

Sentinel
04-08-2009, 11:09 AM
Bob are you a member of the Teochew Association ? I am a pure breed teochew.Wah got thoroughbred, pure breed and what else?

Anyway I am not Teochew but I had a friend who had a ringtone in Teochew that was really funny..

Tia tien uah
Meh meh tia tien uah
Tien uah hiang liau
Tia tien uah
Meh meh tia tien uah...

Ha Ha ... ti kor liang ti kor chor

robertec
04-08-2009, 11:25 AM
Bob are you a member of the Teochew Association ? I am a pure breed teochew.

I would like to know what a pure breed teochew is?

From which part of Chaozhou?

Chia Hak Soon
04-08-2009, 12:31 PM
Pure breed to me means your wife,parents, grandparents and grand grand parents etc are all teochew , no mixture :D

Sentinel
04-08-2009, 01:02 PM
Pure breed to me means your wife,parents, grandparents and grand grand parents etc are all teochew , no mixture :DHow does marrying a Teochew wife makes one a pure breed Teochew?

Most Penang Hokkiens will also attest to their "pure breed Hokkien" thinghy but just ask them to give the Hookien terms for the following products / things : toilet (jamban?), soap (sabun?) and kueh (kueh?) wakakaka....

bobkee
04-08-2009, 01:08 PM
Bob are you a member of the Teochew Association ? I am a pure breed teochew.Not that pure bred lah. My paternal side are Tenghai (Zhenghai) Teochews while my maternal side is Leng Nga (Longyan) Hokkiens. Can qualify ah? :D

bobkee
04-08-2009, 01:15 PM
Interesting how the Selangor KL Teochew Association's website is only in Chinese. Is it implying that if you don't read Chinese, you're not welcome? ;)

besitai2007
04-08-2009, 01:31 PM
I'm a Teochew from Penang. Teochew on my father's side. Mother's Hokkien. Does it mean I'm a half Teochew? :D Unfortunately lost the knack to converse in that dialect. My grandmother used to force us to speak Teochew so that we won't loose our cultural heritage. Ah well, years of English and Penang Hokkien put paid to it. :D

irisbaggins
04-08-2009, 01:31 PM
My dad's family was from Sua Tao.....that was what I was told before my granddad pass away.

bobkee
04-08-2009, 01:42 PM
I'm a Teochew from Penang. Teochew on my father's side. Mother's Hokkien. Does it mean I'm a half Teochew? :D Unfortunately lost the knack to converse in that dialect. My grandmother used to force us to speak Teochew so that we won't loose our cultural heritage. Ah well, years of English and Penang Hokkien put paid to it. :DA friend of mine who's with the Teochew Association of Hawai'i helped initiate Teochew literacy classes for the many multi-generation American born Teochews who have never had the opportunity to hear the language spoken. Maybe this is something our local associations should pick up as well.

In my case, I am able to understand the language but am not able to speak it, having grown up speaking Penang Hokkien, Mandarin, Malay and English.

Sentinel
04-08-2009, 02:40 PM
I am an Eng Choon Hokkien, both parents were also Eng Choon. Married another Hokkien from the Uah Mng (backdoor) group. (Maybe ex-CM Koh Tsu Koon is also a Uah Mng Hokkien - backdoor minister... wakakaka!)

Never been good friends with our Teochew neighbors - maybe we always teased them with the now famous "teochew nang, ka chng ang ang" pranks... hmmm those childhood days!

PeterHng
04-08-2009, 03:37 PM
Me teochew. Father, mother, grandfather, grandmother all teochew but wifey not (Hakka).

fRaNkY
04-08-2009, 04:17 PM
we should have a teochew teh tarik.... hardly have chance to speak tc here.... :)

In JB you have to have a sponsor to get to be a member of teochew assoc. since my dad pass away, none of my family members are members. My ancestor came from china in the late 1800s, till now all teochews :D... till my kids :(

bobkee
04-08-2009, 04:53 PM
The Selangor-KL Teochew Association requires a sponsor too. Does Chia Hak Soon want to do the honours? :D

kimsng
04-08-2009, 07:47 PM
haha awesome vid, imma show this to my grandparents!

pucman
04-08-2009, 08:11 PM
Most Penang Hokkiens will also attest to their "pure breed Hokkien" thinghy but just ask them to give the Hookien terms for the following products / things : toilet (jamban?), soap (sabun?) and kueh (kueh?) wakakaka....

Toilet - Pien So (jamban is malay word)
Soap - sabun (borrowed from portugese word and not malay)
Kueh - Kueh (as in Kueh Tiao, Malay borrow from hokkien)

pucman
04-08-2009, 08:16 PM
Not that pure bred lah. My paternal side are Tenghai (Zhenghai) Teochews while my maternal side is Leng Nga (Longyan) Hokkiens. Can qualify ah? :D

See below.

pucman
04-08-2009, 08:21 PM
I'm a Teochew from Penang. Teochew on my father's side. Mother's Hokkien. Does it mean I'm a half Teochew?

I would say you're a minnan.

There's a misconception in Msia, Spore that the hokkien dialect is one homogenous dialect. Penang hokkien and Klang hokkien are quite different and as different as Penang hokkien and Teo chiu.

There's no such thing as a single hokkien dialect but it is broken down into

1. Chiang Chiu Hokkien (penang)

2. Chuan Chiu hokkien (klang, johor, Spore)

3. Teo Chiu hokkien

4. Amoy hokkien (similar to Taiwanese hokkien)


Just as cantonese has a lot of different dialects other than Hong kong cantonese such as

1. Sei yap cantonese (Toi San)

2. Gwong Fu cantonese (Guang Zhou Cantonese)

pucman
04-08-2009, 08:24 PM
I am an Eng Choon Hokkien, !

Eng Choon falls under Chuan Chiu Hokkien dialect.

Even though you're not teo chiu hokkien, but I am sure you can understand 90% of that video because they are just minnan dialect.

kensu
04-08-2009, 09:24 PM
Pure breed to me means your wife,parents, grandparents and grand grand parents etc are all teochew , no mixture :D

Ha Ha Ha

agree ..so

my parents both maternal and paternal teochews and so were their parents...

how much more to be pure breed...????!!!!! :p

Can speak teochew so more!!!


But too bad.. nowadays most of the younger generations do not speak the dialects...

Suppose we are the ones that seem to have lost the link.. :) :(

Sentinel
04-08-2009, 09:36 PM
Eng Choon falls under Chuan Chiu Hokkien dialect.

Even though you're not teo chiu hokkien, but I am sure you can understand 90% of that video because they are just minnan dialect.
I am guided though by a Teochew phrase I learned from my Teochew distributor is Kulai, ti kor liang ti kor chuo... almost same meaning as my signature in this forum...

bobkee
05-08-2009, 04:03 AM
I would say you're a minnan.

There's a misconception in Msia, Spore that the hokkien dialect is one homogenous dialect. Penang hokkien and Klang hokkien are quite different and as different as Penang hokkien and Teo chiu.

There's no such thing as a single hokkien dialect but it is broken down into

1. Chiang Chiu Hokkien (penang)

2. Chuan Chiu hokkien (klang, johor, Spore)

3. Teo Chiu hokkien

4. Amoy hokkien (similar to Taiwanese hokkien)


Just as cantonese has a lot of different dialects other than Hong kong cantonese such as

1. Sei yap cantonese (Toi San)

2. Gwong Fu cantonese (Guang Zhou Cantonese)Min Nan is the linguistic sub-family, helpful for categorisation but less so for self identity. Its akin to saying that English is not one homogenous language (which it isn't in reality) but actually West Germanic, or that Malay is actually Malayo-Polynesian.

Then again, language is extremely dynamic. Consider the pedigree of the word "sa-boon" (soap) in Penang Hokkien (which some linguists consider to have evolved enough to form a sub branch of the Zhangzhou / Chiang Chiu dialect of Hokkien):

Penang Hokkien, loaned from
Malay, which loaned from
Portuguese, which loaned from
Latin

Its also arguable that the various Chinese "dialects" are actually languages in their own right rather than dialects since they do have certain unique traits and syntax as well as being generally mutually intelligible to the uninformed. Of course, such debates can take a political twist since the term "Chinese" itself is a socio-political construct and exacerbated by the fact that there are 2 nation states that claim the name China as well as the large diaspora that may culturally identify as Chinese but not necessarily politically (ie. in Malaysia).

On a more personal note, while the Longyan dialect is classified under Min Nan, its an interesting polyglot of a form of Min Nan as well as Hakka. So I guess from a linguistic heritage, I would probably still be primarily Min Nan but with a strong peppering of Hakka all over :D Of course, by practice and upbringing, my first and second languages are actually English and Malay followed by the Lower Perak variant of Penang Hokkien and Mandarin. So go figure.

Sigh .. what's wrong with the world today? Where're all the simple black and white answers? ROFL.

Chia Hak Soon
05-08-2009, 10:32 AM
The Teochew Association have their world meet and one thousand representatives all over the world will gather. My wifey dad have pixs of the gathering whereby it comprises of one thousand in one single frame photo.

I was told that they have to employ a regular photograher , a thai lady who will bring their props to make it possible. The last meet in K.L was in Genting Highlands. I will try to post the photo here . Most of those in the photo are with God.

By the way, ' Bak Kutt Teh ' is a teochew dish , which many though it is klang hokkien. It was a dish whereby the fishermen in Pulau Ketam will take before they go out to sea . Since it is near to Klang, this dish becomes famous. :D

Chia Hak Soon
05-08-2009, 10:51 AM
If you want to know more about TeoChew people, log in to 'TCFaces.com" and you will get a update on all the teochews around the world. By the way , the richest man in Honk Kong Li ka shing is a Teochew. :D Ka ki nang

bobkee
05-08-2009, 11:08 AM
Here's another Teochew community site, for the more young'ish at heart ..

http://www.gaginang.org/

Sentinel
05-08-2009, 11:11 AM
Is Thaksin Srinawatra, ex-Thai PM on the run and ex-owner of Manchester City FC, a teochew nang?

Chia Hak Soon
05-08-2009, 11:31 AM
Nope, thaksin's grandfather is a Chinese of Hakka origin married a thai and therefore after his father , he is a thai with chinese blood. not a teochew.

Richard Poh
05-08-2009, 11:47 AM
I would like to know what a pure breed teochew is?

From which part of Chaozhou?
I thought 'breed' refers only to the Animal Kingdom. ?

pucman
05-08-2009, 04:00 PM
Min Nan is the linguistic sub-family, helpful for categorisation but less so for self identity.

Its also arguable that the various Chinese "dialects" are actually languages in their own right rather than dialects since they do have certain unique traits



Let's look at this way, Mandarin, Minnan and cantonese are separate but related languages as they are mainly mutually unintelligible. We can compare them with English and German.

However, Minnan is equivalent to the language English whereas the various dialects cing ciu, cuan ciu, teo ciu, amoy are equivalent to British English, Australian English, American English, Malaysian english etc. They are largely intelligible but with differences.

You can call yourself either an English or to be more precise American English for 'self-identity'. :D

PS. If you think that the differences between teo ciu and cuan ciu is large , just try to listen to other Min languages like Hok Ciu and Hing Hua. You will only understand 10% of it.

bobkee
05-08-2009, 04:22 PM
Like I said, its controversial and the jury is still out on that. :)

pucman
05-08-2009, 08:32 PM
Like I said, its controversial and the jury is still out on that. :)

Hardly, even though I am not a teochew, I can understand nearly 100% of that video once I know the unique teochew terms such as

1. Mit Kai (cuan ciu use 'Sia Mit')
2. Ta (cuan ciu use 'Kong')

The other words are the same or very similar to the other minnan dialects. So I would definitely say it is mutually intelligible.

bobkee
06-08-2009, 10:59 AM
Err .. I meant the classification of dialects and languages, ie. Yueh and Min Nan linguistic families et al. Sub dialects within the same linguistic families tend to at least share some level of intelligibility. Of course, it can differ quite sharply - ie. I can hardly understand Leng Nga dialect, despite it being also a Min Nan sub-dialect.

bslee
06-08-2009, 12:21 PM
Anyway I am not Teochew but I had a friend who had a ringtone in Teochew that was really funny..
Ha Ha ... ti kor liang ti kor chor


Bro Sentinel... you really had me curious about this ringtone... a quick search found me the ringtone... really funny lah!... and NOPE, I ain't teochew, although got TC relatives though..

Really hilarious!... you make my day man!..going to send it out to my TC relatives..hahhaha! Wonder if I can find Hakka ringtones.. :D :D

Jennylim
06-08-2009, 12:36 PM
Interesting how the Selangor KL Teochew Association's website is only in Chinese. Is it implying that if you don't read Chinese, you're not welcome? ;)

May be it means they are lack of capable english speaking members who are willing to contribute.

One thing I am impressed with this organisation was how efficient they conducted the award giving ceremony. It is usually done within three hours, with speeches, and more than 500 award receipients.

pucman
06-08-2009, 12:40 PM
Err .. I meant the classification of dialects and languages, ie. Yueh and Min Nan linguistic families et al.


Anyway, Teochew people are actually originally from Hokkien province so they are considered 'Hokkien lang'. Read

"Between the 9th and the 15th century, a group of Min people migrated south from Fujian to the coastal region of eastern Guangdong now known as Chaoshan"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teochew_dialect

bobkee
06-08-2009, 01:05 PM
Hehe .. yep. My wife's a Cantonese and I sometimes tease her by calling her an Imperialist oppressor of the Teochew people (in more ways than one LOL).

pucman
08-08-2009, 10:16 AM
Hehe .. yep. My wife's a Cantonese and I sometimes tease her by calling her an Imperialist oppressor of the Teochew people (in more ways than one LOL).

There's a misconception that cantonese and hokkien are different ethnicity.

More than 2000 years ago, both cantonese and hokkien came from northern china and spoke similar language.

bobkee
08-08-2009, 05:46 PM
That's a bit more difficult to actually determine. There were independent kingdoms in what is now Southern China and a lot of the descendents of Chinese from those regions (including people like us) are probably from a mixed gene and ethnic pool (Han, Yueh, Tai, Miao, et al).

I believe there was some DNA genome testing done a few years back.

Sentinel
08-08-2009, 10:26 PM
Bro Sentinel... you really had me curious about this ringtone... a quick search found me the ringtone... really funny lah!... and NOPE, I ain't teochew, although got TC relatives though..

Really hilarious!... you make my day man!..going to send it out to my TC relatives..hahhaha! Wonder if I can find Hakka ringtones.. :D :D
You have it downloaded onto your phone? Next time bluetooth to me can? I want to pass to my teochew nang friends....

pucman
09-08-2009, 07:50 PM
Nevertheless, in terms of statistics the teochew should be grouped under hokkien instead of a separate group. 'Hokkien' is not a single dialect too but consists of minimum 3 dialects.

nct
09-08-2009, 08:01 PM
Min Nan is the linguistic sub-family, helpful for categorisation but less so for self identity. Its akin to saying that English is not one homogenous language (which it isn't in reality) but actually West Germanic, or that Malay is actually Malayo-Polynesian.

Then again, language is extremely dynamic. Consider the pedigree of the word "sa-boon" (soap) in Penang Hokkien (which some linguists consider to have evolved enough to form a sub branch of the Zhangzhou / Chiang Chiu dialect of Hokkien):

Penang Hokkien, loaned from
Malay, which loaned from
Portuguese, which loaned from
Latin

Its also arguable that the various Chinese "dialects" are actually languages in their own right rather than dialects since they do have certain unique traits and syntax as well as being generally mutually intelligible to the uninformed. Of course, such debates can take a political twist since the term "Chinese" itself is a socio-political construct and exacerbated by the fact that there are 2 nation states that claim the name China as well as the large diaspora that may culturally identify as Chinese but not necessarily politically (ie. in Malaysia).

On a more personal note, while the Longyan dialect is classified under Min Nan, its an interesting polyglot of a form of Min Nan as well as Hakka. So I guess from a linguistic heritage, I would probably still be primarily Min Nan but with a strong peppering of Hakka all over :D Of course, by practice and upbringing, my first and second languages are actually English and Malay followed by the Lower Perak variant of Penang Hokkien and Mandarin. So go figure.

Sigh .. what's wrong with the world today? Where're all the simple black and white answers? ROFL.

For those who want to know more of Minnan, you may try this forum:
http://www.chinalanguage.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=6

tupai
09-08-2009, 08:13 PM
Err .. I meant the classification of dialects and languages, ie. Yueh and Min Nan linguistic families et al. Sub dialects within the same linguistic families tend to at least share some level of intelligibility. Of course, it can differ quite sharply - ie. I can hardly understand Leng Nga dialect, despite it being also a Min Nan sub-dialect.

As a child I used to listen to my grandma speaking this Leng Nga with her friends. Alas after 103yrs, she already gone back Thng Sua leow... My parents & relatives also don't or probably dont know how to speak this dialect/language. I guess this Leng Nga language just died a natural death in my family :o very sad indeed!

All this Ang-Moh-Beh is bad for roots!

Yang Beh-heow kong Leng Nga latotupai

pucman
09-08-2009, 11:13 PM
As a child I used to listen to my grandma speaking this Leng Nga with her friends. Alas after 103yrs, she already gone back Thng Sua leow... My parents & relatives also don't or probably dont know how to speak this dialect/language. I guess this Leng Nga language just died a natural death in my family :o very sad indeed!

All this Ang-Moh-Beh is bad for roots!

Yang Beh-heow kong Leng Nga latotupai


Doesn't matter, what we need now is a standard hokkien dialect which is based on amoy dialect.

Just as the cantonese has a standard dialect based on hong kong dialect. The hokkien (including teochew) should also have a standard dialect .

So start learning from the taiwanese hokkien shows. :D

bobkee
10-08-2009, 02:52 AM
As a child I used to listen to my grandma speaking this Leng Nga with her friends. Alas after 103yrs, she already gone back Thng Sua leow... My parents & relatives also don't or probably dont know how to speak this dialect/language. I guess this Leng Nga language just died a natural death in my family :o very sad indeed!

All this Ang-Moh-Beh is bad for roots!

Yang Beh-heow kong Leng Nga latotupaiThere is an active Longyan / Leng Nga community up north in Parit Buntar and its surrounds. The language is still pretty much alive there.

bobkee
10-08-2009, 02:54 AM
Doesn't matter, what we need now is a standard hokkien dialect which is based on amoy dialect.

Just as the cantonese has a standard dialect based on hong kong dialect. The hokkien (including teochew) should also have a standard dialect .

So start learning from the taiwanese hokkien shows. :DMajor disagreement here! If any standardisation should be considered, it ought to be based on the way supreme Penang Hokkien variant .. ROFL!