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silver_bird
06-07-2009, 12:00 PM
On 25 May 2009, Art Director Mr Mohan Singh, 41 yrs old died of heart attack

# The following week, Syariah Court ruled that Mohan was a Muslim when he died and should be buried according to Muslim rites

# But deceased family filed for a judicial review against the Sungai Buloh Hospitalís decision not to release the body to them to be cremated according to Sikh rites.

# Deceased family claimed that Mohan had neither converted nor practised Islam as he practiced Sikhism and had performed the last rites for his late mother three years ago.

# However, Shah Alam High Court this morning ruled that deceased Mohan Singh had converted to Islam and that it is the Syariah Court that has the jurisdiction to determine if he was still a Muslim at the time of his death on May 25.

http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2009/7/6/nation/20090706103314&sec=nation

Hello People,
It's your choice of Religion.
Convert by all means but at the same time update your family
Please leave this world peacefully and do not burden your love ones

kpc
06-07-2009, 12:12 PM
The problem with religions is that all religions requires mutual exclusivity.

For example, a Christian is not allowed (by the pastor) to Cheng Beng with joss sticks or meditate in a Buddhist temple.

Why can't a Christian meditate?

Why can't a person have 2 religions?

Why can't a body be given 2 funeral rites?

silver_bird
06-07-2009, 12:47 PM
When there is only one GOD, why are there so many religions ?
I beg to know the answer.

bugbear
06-07-2009, 01:18 PM
The problem with religions is that all religions requires mutual exclusivity.

For example, a Christian is not allowed (by the pastor) to Cheng Beng with joss sticks or meditate in a Buddhist temple.

Why can't a Christian meditate?

Why can't a person have 2 religions?

Why can't a body be given 2 funeral rites?
I believe, we as human cannot serve two masters. You either believe one and reject the other or none at all. As Christian, we are not allow to participate in ritual which is in conflict with our faith. As to your third question, it is pertinent to the above case and is quite sensitive. This is very sad. :(

bslee
06-07-2009, 01:46 PM
There'll be no end to arguement or debate on religion. Just be good, do what you think is right, just respect, never offend other people, and NEVER to get entangled with the law of the land...PERIOD!

AllUrban
06-07-2009, 02:01 PM
When there is only one GOD, why are there so many religions ?
I beg to know the answer.one GOD? hahahah which one are you referring to? :) I can think of dozens offhand and there are thousands and thousands more than that who have been hailed, prayed to, worshipped, feared, loved etc. etc. :)

Cheers, m

adamx
06-07-2009, 02:34 PM
what to do, Micheal Jackson out of reach, Mohan Singh good enough lah :D

Jey
06-07-2009, 02:35 PM
Why can't a body be given 2 funeral rites?

How can a body be given 2 funeral rites?
Bury one half of the body according to religion A and cremate the other half according to religion B? :D

:eek: :eek:

tupai
06-07-2009, 02:35 PM
...and each individual religion says ~ "thou shalt follow me or thou shalt go to hell" in many dialects and languages...~

So, in a bigger scheme of things:

Everybody pasti/guarantee will go to hell! Q.E.D. (except some pay lotsa RmXXXXXXX to go there lah..others almost free lah)

hahahahahahah! Just Live this life today to the fullest...BUT do not to others what u dont wanna other idiots to do to u lah...the rest are trivial pursuits!

Let the afterlife takes care regardless of which hell lah! :D :D

"Prove me wrong" ~ quoted from Mighty Neebonazeeker. :D

Yang Berlivin' NOW latotupai

tupai
06-07-2009, 02:40 PM
The problem with religions is that all religions requires mutual exclusivity.

For example, a Christian is not allowed (by the pastor) to Cheng Beng with joss sticks or meditate in a Buddhist temple.

~ It depend on which church lah...SIC allows.

Why can't a Christian meditate?
~ bcos with a third eye, they might become hindu?

Why can't a person have 2 religions?
~ Can bolehland got a few cases leow~

Why can't a body be given 2 funeral rites?
~ can, bolehland had a few cases leow...but the latter burial wins lah...so every lost?


Yang Bersembayang to all GODs latotupai

kpc
06-07-2009, 04:04 PM
How can a body be given 2 funeral rites?
Easy, bury the body according the Sikh rites first, the dig it up and cremate it according to Muslim rites.

A lot of Chinese funerals now do the Taoist rites first, then followed by Buddhist chantings.

Having 2 or more funeral rites has some advantages.
It is a form of insurance. What if the 1st religion turned out to be false?
At least you have a backup from the 2nd religion.

AllUrban
06-07-2009, 05:03 PM
How can a body be given 2 funeral rites?
Easy, bury the body according the Sikh rites first, the dig it up and cremate it according to Muslim rites.

A lot of Chinese funerals now do the Taoist rites first, then followed by Buddhist chantings.

Having 2 or more funeral rites has some advantages.
It is a form of insurance. What if the 1st religion turned out to be false?
At least you have a backup from the 2nd religion.er...not to nitpick here but most muslims aren't into the cremation thing....

now...having a tree planted on top of my grave...that is an idea I can live down for....

As for hedging your bets by having multiple ceremonies ... logical and practical ... ... but it defeats the whole idea of what having a "faith" actually means ...

Cheers, m

silver_bird
06-07-2009, 05:14 PM
Burial dispute is just a 'chicken-feed' matter.
Bigger problem is when the decease masuk Islam before his last breath, his Sikh family and children are not entitle to inherit his property if he dies interstate.

AllUrban
06-07-2009, 06:05 PM
Burial dispute is just a 'chicken-feed' matter.
Bigger problem is when the decease masuk Islam before his last breath, his Sikh family and children are not entitle to inherit his property if he dies interstate.Good point ... that is a specifically Malaysian thing. My understanding of Islam is that your family has the right to you and your assets ... and you are responsible for them and to them ... even if they have a different religion.

Speaking as a muslim and a human, it saddens me that people are willing to cheapen the faith and abuse it by taking actions such as these: snatching bodies, converting to take property / children / exit a relationship

I know it is not up to me to judge what is people's hearts ... I leave that to God to do ... but it still makes me sick (as a muslim and as a human) and I have no problem expressing my revulsion at the slime who do such things! :mad:

Chjeers, m

Fang Su
06-07-2009, 08:05 PM
I believe, we as human cannot serve two masters. You either believe one and reject the other or none at all. As Christian, we are not allow to participate in ritual which is in conflict with our faith. As to your third question, it is pertinent to the above case and is quite sensitive. This is very sad. :(

I disagree. Of course you can serve two or even multiple masters. I believe in different religions and all of them teach me one universal truth: Do unto others as you would have others do unto you.

kwchang
06-07-2009, 11:54 PM
As usual, discussions on religion end up nowhere except in a lot of different views.

Push not your belief onto others because finally it is a personal choice. What is left in the physical world are just material items. If you believe in a higher (spiritual) level of existence then good for you...

I shall leave it just there because any more comments will just put me on the merry go round.

MasterQ
07-07-2009, 12:25 AM
KPC, you just got EVERYTHING wrong.


How can a body be given 2 funeral rites? Easy, bury the body according the Sikh rites first, the dig it up and cremate it according to Muslim rites.
I think you are saying this out of spite. You are not giving the dead the due respect. May God have mercy upon you.


A lot of Chinese funerals now do the Taoist rites first, then followed by Buddhist chantings.
Even I as a Christian know that there is no such thing. This shows either you are a confused cat or ignorant. When ignorance is bliss, it is folly to be wise.



Having 2 or more funeral rites has some advantages.
It is a form of insurance. What if the 1st religion turned out to be false?
At least you have a backup from the 2nd religion.
Even if you die and we bury you using all the known funeral rites known to man, it will not save you. Funeral rites do not determine the route to heaven or to hell. Going to heaven or to hell has everything to do when you are living.

bugbear
07-07-2009, 09:31 AM
As usual, discussions on religion end up nowhere except in a lot of different views.

Push not your belief onto others because finally it is a personal choice. What is left in the physical world are just material items. If you believe in a higher (spiritual) level of existence then good for you...

I shall leave it just there because any more comments will just put me on the merry go round.
I agree with you in principle there kwchang. But it is good to let people explore their religion as well as others in order to gain more insight. I believe in learning and understanding other religion and practices otherwise we will all be myopic in our view. ;)

USJ27Resident
07-07-2009, 10:04 AM
Going to heaven or to hell has everything to do when you are living.

... if atheists and scientists comes into the equation, we all end up being nothing but part of the ecological cycle... :eek:

bugbear
07-07-2009, 10:25 AM
... if atheists and scientists comes into the equation, we all end up being nothing but part of the ecological cycle... :eek:
But seriously...there must be some purpose to existence than just being born and die? Look at our body, I cannot accept that it is just a random event and nothing more. :cool:

AllUrban
07-07-2009, 10:56 AM
But seriously...there must be some purpose to existence than just being born and die? Look at our body, I cannot accept that it is just a random event and nothing more. :cool:interesting point...and yet, if that random event followed by a series of non-random events is the way it happened...does that make your body any less amazing? Or your mind any less wonderful?

I remember in biology class my prof suggested that all things that exist are special, in their own way, simply because they exist. Every leaf, rock, worm, thunderstorm, human being, majestic animal, all special and wonderful. :)

Cheers, m

Chia Hak Soon
07-07-2009, 12:08 PM
This body snatching is done on the context of religion or politics ? Even on both account it is wrong as it angered the immediate family of the deceased and one must think in time of grief who give these people the right to stop the immediate family to collect his body and offer a honourable burial.

What if it is done to their own, how do they feel.? It sad that humans are so selfish and whatever religion's doctrine , are they playing God or Satan or just themselves. May the dead rest in peace.

USJ27Resident
07-07-2009, 12:15 PM
But seriously...there must be some purpose to existence than just being born and die?. :cool:

if we as humans had the RIGHT answer to that [purpose] question, it would hell, explain a whole load of questions to our existence...

as it is... it now boils down to faith and fate... no? :)

bugbear
07-07-2009, 01:07 PM
interesting point...and yet, if that random event followed by a series of non-random events is the way it happened...does that make your body any less amazing? Or your mind any less wonderful?

I remember in biology class my prof suggested that all things that exist are special, in their own way, simply because they exist. Every leaf, rock, worm, thunderstorm, human being, majestic animal, all special and wonderful. :)

Cheers, m
I do not get your drift. Our body is a created being from a creator and not a chance occurent.

jianwei85
07-07-2009, 01:21 PM
i suggest we should all make a religion disclaimer early in life?

AllUrban
07-07-2009, 02:15 PM
I do not get your drift. Our body is a created being from a creator and not a chance occurent.That is one way to look at it. :) There are others ... many others ...

some involve a creator working directly, some involve a creator working indirectly, some mention randomness, some have no specific creator, some have an "anti-creator", some present an image that goes beyond a specific creator, and I could go on and on.

The point is this: no matter if there was a creator or not, all of the things that exist (or were created) are amazing in their own right because they exist.

But why confuse things ... CCY is correct ... the 'body snatching' in this thread is about politics and 'being right' and that has very little to do with the religion and more to do with imposing their will on others.

Cheers, m

CCY
07-07-2009, 03:40 PM
But why confuse things ... CCY is correct ... the 'body snatching' in this thread is about politics and 'being right' and that has very little to do with the religion and more to do with imposing their will on others.

Cheers, m

Hmmmmmmm.....hahaha M...Are you snatching my 'body' without my knowing and hope to get away with it ah. ;) :D:D..

Gosh...I'm more confuse then ever....over these snatch here snatch there....and all I know is that the worms n germs would definitely take over the body when you're dead.....

Fang Su
07-07-2009, 08:27 PM
The point is this: no matter if there was a creator or not, all of the things that exist (or were created) are amazing in their own right because they exist.

Absolutely spot on.

Fang Su
07-07-2009, 08:34 PM
Going to heaven or to hell has everything to do when you are living.

There is no heaven or hell. Real heaven and hell exist on earth and now. The belief in a supernatural source of good and evil is not necessary. Men alone are quite capable of every good and wickedness. Just take a look around you.

Nick Chia
07-07-2009, 10:10 PM
These body snatchers, in their past life they must be germs,maggots, flies and vultures.

Nick Chia
07-07-2009, 10:12 PM
Luckily, Micheal Jackson died in U.S.A. if it is in Malaysia, the body snatchers will create havoc for his family members

silver_bird
08-07-2009, 01:12 AM
Hello People,
It's your choice of Religion.
Convert by all means but at the same time update your family
Please leave this world peacefully and do not burden your love ones

So far, most (if not all) of the comments are on "body-snatching" & "dispute of religion".
Please look at a bigger picture. If one wishes to convert to other religion, he or she must be brave to inform their love ones.
Why deprived them of the vital information ? Why create problem and leave behind the mess when he or she leave this world ?

Chia Hak Soon
08-07-2009, 10:59 AM
The theme here is the intrusion of family matters pertaining to the loss of a loved one and in time of grief. How do you like to go to the hospital and being informed of the death of a love one and when you are to collect the body, the officers says that you must prove his religion if someone make a claim against you or your family 's version before they release the body.

You have seen and heard of some who converted against the religion and despite all the courts hearing it is condemned. No futher questions.