PDA

View Full Version : ACA to become MCAC for full transparency?



racheljansz
21-04-2008, 01:15 PM
PM invests significant powers and proper oversight in new and improved anti-graft agency (http://themalaysianinsider.com/mni/going-for-full-transparency-aca-to-become-mcac.html)
Am I dreaming?
or it this just talk?
Model after Hong Kong famous ICAC?
Exact model?

From his 'walk with me and Walk the talk' track record,
I am skeptical till it actually materialized,
and if it materialized, we are certainly living in interesting times.

Nevertheless, I pray that he has the strength and will power to pull it through.

StonTemplePilot
21-04-2008, 01:35 PM
Nothing can be truly independent in Malaysia. Dun get the hopes high for these gimmicks, Judicial commissions, ICACs, IPCMCs, Special commissions.

firefox
21-04-2008, 03:54 PM
Next hes going to abolish ISA watch and see.

HAN2
21-04-2008, 05:40 PM
Desperate people do desperate things... a drowning man will grab at anything to stay afloat.

I will only believe it when it actually happen. Enough of lies from the man...

racheljansz
21-04-2008, 05:43 PM
This is what Uncle Lim has to say
Malaysians will not want a new anti-corruption commission which purports to be independent in name only.
In fact, spearheading the fight against corruption to restore integrity in the nationís public life.
And not to become a second Suhakam which is tasked to be an independent body to protect and promote human rights but is completely unable to do so without the necessary powers and wherewithal to carry out such a human rights mandate. (http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/21/anti-corruption-reform-abdullah-pre-empting-parliamary-question-directed-to-him-next-week/#more-1162) adapted.

We will have to see 'the walk' and the cascading affect on our lives.
Most definitely it going to be very interesting for all of us.

Rocky19
21-04-2008, 08:46 PM
if I'm the PM I'll make sure the ACA is independent. Why? well Pak Lah needs to ensure that he goes down well in history and right now history will judge him not so well. But this new initiatives must be true, not a smoke screen or half hearted jobs which is all indah khabar dari rupa. Pak Lah should know the people are not all stupid and will be looking at the new initiatives to see if they are real and what we want, in this case a truly independent ACA.

Only a 8th March has made Pak Lah and BN do the things they promised us in BN 2004 manifesto.After the election, they have to work and not take us for granted. Never give a govt a 2/3 majority cos they will abuse it.

bobkee
21-04-2008, 09:00 PM
Wan Azizah: Proposal meaningless without legislative reform

http://www.keadilanrakyat.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=608&Itemid=27

praetor
22-04-2008, 12:29 AM
Nothing can be truly independent in Malaysia. Dun get the hopes high for these gimmicks, Judicial commissions, ICACs, IPCMCs, Special commissions.

Greetings.

If we maintain this defeatist attitude then we are truly gone for good. Life is full of what ifs, If only the PM did what he promised us 4 years ago he wouldn't have suffered such a big defeat in the GE, If only Hishamuddin did not wield the keris then he would not be such an unpopular figure, the list of what if goes on. If our PM is genuine in making the ACA a force that commands our respect in the fight against corruption, shouldn't we help in that cause? Unless of course, we are all happy to be bashing and not happy to bring our country to greater heights.

Ave!

isarahim
22-04-2008, 06:39 AM
Nothing can be truly independent in Malaysia. Dun get the hopes high for these gimmicks, Judicial commissions, ICACs, IPCMCs, Special commissions.
You forgot to add 'as long as UMNO is in power'.

bobkee
22-04-2008, 08:27 AM
Greetings.

If we maintain this defeatist attitude then we are truly gone for good. Life is full of what ifs, If only the PM did what he promised us 4 years ago he wouldn't have suffered such a big defeat in the GE, If only Hishamuddin did not wield the keris then he would not be such an unpopular figure, the list of what if goes on. If our PM is genuine in making the ACA a force that commands our respect in the fight against corruption, shouldn't we help in that cause? Unless of course, we are all happy to be bashing and not happy to bring our country to greater heights.

Ave!That might be part of the problem previously, a PM that was long on promises but woefully short on delivery. Right now, we are again seeing promises .. and not particularly attractive ones either. Don't blame folks for being cynical.

Like the promised MCAC for instance. Apart from making the bureaucracy larger, what substantial changes have been made? The proposed accountability structure is still weak and dangerously open to abuse and the power of prosecution remains in the hands of an appointed Attorney General.

Personally, I've yet to be impressed.

isarahim
22-04-2008, 09:36 AM
If our PM is genuine in making the ACA a force that commands our respect in the fight against corruption, shouldn't we help in that cause?
You actually put the finger on the spot there. Does the current MCAC proposition project that genuinity of the PM? That question must be asked! I think it does NOT. It doesn't address the root of the problem. It's merely yet another smokescreen; with the lewd intention of buying a few years more time until the rakyat realise they've been tricked again.

praetor
22-04-2008, 10:29 AM
It's merely yet another smokescreen; with the lewd intention of buying a few years more time until the rakyat realise they've been tricked again.

Greetings.

Aye, i can't help but agree with that statement. We've been promised so much and so little has come to our way. To say we are disappointed is an understatement. Frankly, to an extent you and i know this is a charade to lead us all on a false impression that the current administration is out to do something right but deep down inside we all want it to happen because it is time. I'll give the current administration the benefit of the doubt for another year and if nothing tangible comes out of it then.. it's a secret.

Ave!

bslee
22-04-2008, 10:51 AM
Greetings.

We've been promised so much and so little has come to our way. To say we are disappointed is an understatement.


I don't trust this UMNO led gahmen anymore till I kick the bucket. I've said it time and again, 50 years enough! :)

racheljansz
22-04-2008, 11:04 AM
....with the lewd intention of buying a few years more time until the rakyat realise they've been tricked again.Buying time till end of year?
Nevertheless, I for one will support him to get it as close as possible to be like Hong Kong's ICAC.
If the makkal sakti voice is loud enough,
and the rakyat hearts burning hot,
it does not matter if it started out as a smokescreen or gimmick.

One of the keys to the success of Hong Kong's ICAC is their mass media.
Hong Kong's ICAC(Independent Commission Against Corruption) is subject to close public scrutiny through the mass media.
Which I hope our government will let our mass media to regulate themselves.

bslee
22-04-2008, 11:32 AM
Which I hope our government will let our mass media to regulate themselves.
I just don't see it happening if this country as long as its BN or UMNO led. They insist on having a hand in EVERYTHING. Whilst our neighbors have great TV shows..look at ours?.. its like 1 decade behind in entertainment and variety. Even seemingly poor folks in Philipines get better TV programs than us. Singapore has a dominant party for close to 50 years but its one with QUALITY that pleases its citizens. Here we have QUANTITY, not QUALITY!
Here!..they think whats best for you, not the other way around. You're even deemed as obligated to vote for them.
They're also SUPER Sensitive and NEVER want to be challenged nor criticised. 50 years have proven that time and again. Didn't he say aloud " Saya pantang dicabar!". It has deep meaning.

bobkee
22-04-2008, 11:41 AM
I've been thinking .. perhaps the PM is really trying to institute some institutional reforms before the seemingly inevitable occurs; ie. the deposing from Umno's presidency. If that is true, then he might just able to leave office with his head high, knowing that he did what he had to do for Malaysia and leave Umno with the burden of responsibility to bear the wrath of Malaysians as the organisation rightly deserves.

racheljansz
22-04-2008, 12:05 PM
I've been thinking .. perhaps the PM is really trying to institute some institutional reforms before the seemingly inevitable occurs; ie. the deposing from Umno's presidency. If that is true, then he might just able to leave office with his head high, knowing that he did what he had to do for Malaysia and leave Umno with the burden of responsibility to bear the wrath of Malaysians as the organisation rightly deserves.Exactly my thoughts too.
If he gets it right, the Independent Judiciary and MCAC, before he leaves, his head will be the highest than all the have come before him.
That is something money cannot buy :D

CS Chua
22-04-2008, 12:06 PM
I do not understand some of the negative sentiments expressed here regarding the proposed reforms. The BN lost heavily because they did not fulfill their promises. And now, I am told they are going to commit suicide by repeating that? And not in an election year?

What good could possibly come from making and breaking promises again to the rakyat? It is 5 years to the next GE. Can they keep it up? Year after year? Come on, let us use some common sense.

The PM is sincere. That much I believe. But can he pull it off? There are elements in UMNO trying to stop him and we are not helping by being so negative. After all, we have shown that we can demonstrate our displeasure through the ballot boxes. And they are now afraid of that. And they will be very stupid to try their old tricks again.

I say, give the PM a chance to fulfill his 2004 election promises. If he cannot, then let us vote in a new government.

silver_bird
22-04-2008, 12:20 PM
This guy has been battling against corruption for donkey years.
His name : Mohamad Ezam Mohd Nor
His organisation : Civil Movement against Corruption (Gerak)
MCAC must not leave him out.

http://info.gerakmalaysia.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=12&Itemid=26

http://info.gerakmalaysia.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=0&Itemid=27

racheljansz
22-04-2008, 12:21 PM
CS Chua - Most people have negative sentiments because like you say "elements in UMNO".
These elements are scared of the implication of the Independent Judiciary and MCAC.
Look at the missing and shredding documents case when Pakatan took over.
or the Trengganu Wang Ehsan case.
The Elements will definitely do whatever it takes to prevent ABB from making these bodies independent!
Can he pull it off?
That depends on the rakyat ability to show support for him. ;)

StonTemplePilot
22-04-2008, 12:27 PM
CS Chua - Most people have negative sentiments because like you say "elements in UMNO".
These elements are scared of the implication of the Independent Judiciary and MCAC.
Look at the missing and shredding documents case when Pakatan took over.
or the Trengganu Wang Ehsan case.
The Elements will definitely do whatever it takes to prevent ABB from making these bodies independent!
Can he pull it off?
That depends on the rakyat ability to show support for him. ;)

Wasn't 91% support from the 2004 election support enough? Some forumers may say that govt will change/afraid to do bad etc...i dun see it coz they are still in a state of denial.

To me, the current leadership is plain and simple INCOMPETENT. Period.

bslee
22-04-2008, 12:34 PM
I say, give the PM a chance to fulfill his 2004 election promises. If he cannot, then let us vote in a new government.

The PM is NO dictator (thats why he can make 1001 promises and he'll never live up to it), can't undo things the amount of corruption, incompetency and abuse that are already gangrenous or still happen till the next GE. The whole jing bang have to be replaced for drastic changes and working culture to be reformed....period!. No time to replace one or two individuals..you cut the whole gangrenous leg OUT!.

burntan
22-04-2008, 12:52 PM
I think if Malaysia want to learn from HK to have Independant ACA like ICAC, then we should learn the whole things like what ICAC did earlier when they intially setup..... forgive the past, ICAC can't sure anyone for corruption done before ICAC setup.

PM and his relative must be especially be exampted, then only a truly independant ACA can be form.

racheljansz
22-04-2008, 12:54 PM
Wasn't 91% support from the 2004 election support enough? That time he was drowning in euphoria.
Now he is fighting for the Primership and he know his days are numbered!
and,
How he wish to be remembered best by the Rakyat?
INCOMPETENT or .....???


Here are some info on Judicial reckoning.
http://www.malaysia-today.net/2008/content/view/6450/1/

isarahim
22-04-2008, 01:21 PM
I've been thinking .. perhaps the PM is really trying to institute some institutional reforms before the seemingly inevitable occurs; ie. the deposing from Umno's presidency.
You might have a point. A man's last wish; to leave some form of legacy....

Blue Jasmine
22-04-2008, 02:13 PM
You might have a point. A man's last wish; to leave some form of legacy....

well honestly i dont believe it ....just unbelieveable..tell that to the whole nation somemore....unbelieveable......the news headline and all...very tricky...i smell a rotten fish somewhere

firefox
22-04-2008, 02:33 PM
What is more important is to eradicate corruption for good not to give room for it and then see if you get caught..waste of public funds and time.
Pak Lah's priority should be to have a transperency system in the government that does not breed and encourage corruption at all. Thats a tall order i suppose.

He is endorsing to the world that he is running a corrupted government and there is nothing he can do.

bobkee
22-04-2008, 02:58 PM
CS Chua - Most people have negative sentiments because like you say "elements in UMNO".
These elements are scared of the implication of the Independent Judiciary and MCAC.
Look at the missing and shredding documents case when Pakatan took over.
or the Trengganu Wang Ehsan case.
The Elements will definitely do whatever it takes to prevent ABB from making these bodies independent!
Can he pull it off?
That depends on the rakyat ability to show support for him. ;)I said this in 2004 and I will say it again, putting in a strong Opposition in the Federal Parliament is the only way the BN administration will find political will to initiate reforms. At this stage, some "revolutionary" changes might also be necessary which might mean putting the BN out in the pasture for a few terms to reform themselves and reorganise as a credible political organisation with a proper agenda rather than just harping on 50 year old issues.

CS Chua
22-04-2008, 06:41 PM
Change has to be gradual. I vote for evolutionary changes rather than revolutionary changes. Some of the forumers want revolutionary changes but is that wise?

The country is like a big ship. When you turn the wheel, it takes a long time before it starts to turn to the direction you set. You cannot pilot a ship like the way you drive your car. If you use the car driving style to pilot a ship, you will find the ship behaving erratically.

The PM has to lay down fundamental changes. The freedom to dissent must be continued. The judiciary must be reformed and the police force too. The police force is too powerful. It should be restructured. The Special Branch should be independent and focus on intelligence like the FBI, MI6 etc. The police force should focus on crime fighting only and nothing else.

bobkee
22-04-2008, 06:47 PM
Change has to be gradual. I vote for evolutionary changes rather than revolutionary changes. Some of the forumers want revolutionary changes but is that wise?

The country is like a big ship. When you turn the wheel, it takes a long time before it starts to turn to the direction you set. You cannot pilot a ship like the way you drive your car. If you use the car driving style to pilot a ship, you will find the ship behaving erratically.

The PM has to lay down fundamental changes. The freedom to dissent must be continued. The judiciary must be reformed and the police force too. The police force is too powerful. It should be restructured. The Special Branch should be independent and focus on intelligence like the FBI, MI6 etc. The police force should focus on crime fighting only and nothing else.The changes that you mentioned would be "revolutionary" in our context and I really don't see the BN having the necessary political will to bring those about if the current half measure promises about reform of the judiciary and the ACA is any gauge.

isarahim
22-04-2008, 07:16 PM
What has worked before in Hong Kong, and moreover whose system of governance is based on Westminster like ours, can hardly be considered 'revolutionary'.

It's rather a choice between (1.) painting your anthrax with make-up powder versus (2.) actually curing it.

Rocky19
22-04-2008, 07:51 PM
What has worked before in Hong Kong, and moreover whose system of governance is based on Westminster like ours, can hardly be considered 'revolutionary'.


revolutionary it is not.nor it has to have majority support of the people like 91% seats or 63% voter supports. What is needed is having the balls to do it and the will power to see it thru. Pak Lah should also understand that when he issued his BN 2004 manifesto, he never mentioned it was meant to till 2020 and no manifesto should be based on such a long term.H is moving the goalpost. Even if he did want it till 2020, he should clearly spell it out with an action plan. Only with a result like 12th GE, will he an BN take action cos that is what the people want, an independent ACA which Nazri claim that we the people do not want back in 2006/2007.

I still don't like that the MCAC reports to the PM.

isarahim
22-04-2008, 08:06 PM
I still don't like that the MCAC reports to the PM.
Yes. Neither do I!!!

That's one key reason why this is painting make-up powder on anthrax.

praetor
22-04-2008, 08:43 PM
Greetings.

The MCAC should be accountable only to the Parliament and not anyone else. It do reek of something fishy don't you all think so? If you are accountable to the Parliament then you are accountable to the electorate but the way i see it now, this is no more than a shadow play meant to distract us from something bigger at work. I sense something is amiss.. big time.

Ave!

CS Chua
22-04-2008, 09:41 PM
Whatever our sentiments, it gotta be better than what we got now. 3/4 is better than 1/2. Come the 13th GE, we will have the whole cake.

racheljansz
22-04-2008, 11:25 PM
What is needed is having the balls to do it and the will power to see it thru.he may have the apparatus but what makes you think with ABB's track record that this is going to happen?

As I have said before
we DEFINITELY NEED to help him set these 2 bodies right with pressure groups, MPs, NGOs
He may have initiate it but
there are many forces that will be very happy if these 2 bodies improvement do not materalised.

Yes Rocky19, praetor & isarahim, I too am not happy on the lines of reporting and the "check & balance".
Which is why all of us have to play our role right by highlight the keys elements to your MPs, NGOs and other pressure groups on ensuring they are in place for this Bolehland's ICAC.

As most of us as net savvy, it is not too difficult to look at the keys elements of the fame Hong Kong's ICAC.
You will be pleasantly surprise what the keys elements are.

Now is the NOT time to compliant, like tupai suggest, time Rakyat also to buat kerja!

Do also remember ABB is also fighting for the Premiership and his days are numbered.
I do not mind if he is trying to leave this as his legacy.
and bear in mind that there are many people in his camp who would love to see Independent Judiciary and ACA never happens!

At the end of it, how these 2 bodies becomes independent and effective depends VERY much the Rakyat willingness to go through to achieve it!

Makkal Sakti?

PS,
CS Chua I do NOT want to wait for next GE la,
Carpe diem!
So many people waiting la...Mongolian father, Ah Peng in Thailand, Lingam, Klang....
Anyway 13 not lucky number for me :D

Rocky19
22-04-2008, 11:48 PM
he may have the apparatus but what makes you think with ABB's track record that this is going to happen?

I don't think he can but let him try lo and prove some of us wrong. He is going after legacy and if he does pull it off, it is a good result for Malaysians and the country.

sinleong
23-04-2008, 12:00 AM
take a look at anil netto's blog. http://anilnetto.com/
apparently the MCAC will not be independent as at the end of the day, it still reports to the PM. how can badawi allow MCAC to be independent? he and his family will be first to be investigated if that's the case. don't forget there are some very clear conflict of interests cases against badawi and his family:

1. he wrote a letter to support his sister's in law company for the UN oil for food program
2. as minister of finance, he awarded to his son's company billions worth of contract in petronas, public transport system (MTRANS buses) and monorail project
3. as minister of finance, he approved the merger of ECM libra when his son in law was a shareholder

i could list them all...but too many. i think you know what i am talking about. that's why he doesnt want to step down. if he steps down without laying his guards properly, he will go straight in jail.

racheljansz
23-04-2008, 12:13 AM
i could list them all...but too many. i think you know what i am talking about. that's why he doesnt want to step down. if he steps down without laying his guards properly, he will go straight in jail.
sinleong, no need take a look at anil netto's blog la.
After 22 years of crony under the tutelage of Master TDM,
you still think there are no skeletons in their closet?

It is now not question of choice whether he wants or not wants to step down.
Sudah di takdir la.
His days are numbered!

He has initiate it,
and it going to be up to us the rakyat to ensure it is correctly structured
and all the essential elements are in place.

Please write to your MP, NGO and other pressure groups.
Tell them your expectations.
Text, email your friends on the key elements, check and balances of the fame Hong Kong ICAC.
here is their web site
http://www.icac.org.hk/en/home/index.html